I was listening to a few discussions on the gangland issues facing in particular the north inner city of our capital. One guy was astonished that is could happen right in the middle of where people live, work and socialise. He described flowers left at a closed bar not far from Croke Park, he talked of children unable to sleep at night being traumatised over what was happening right in their community.
Many of us in the north can only too well empathise with them and can understand exactly what they are going through. Violence and armed groups have no place in any part of a future Ireland, but are our elected representatives doing all they can to make sure that this is realised?
I was listening to Mary Lou this evening and her passion over dealing with what was happening in the north of the city was clear and invigorating. She would make a wonderful Taoiseach although would be a loss to the people of north Dublin at a local level whom she represents so well.
Some of the issues discussed were also very familiar.
Not enough police on the streets while too many are sat behind desks doing work that could just as easily be done by a civilian workforce. Cuts, both to budgets and to the police numbers on the ground. Task forces left with not even a shoestring budget and with each incident, the acceptance and normalisation of violence setting in, again something we know too well in the north. When faced with extreme situations often enough, they become the norm and you just get on with it.
It is very clear that special attention is going to be needed here, this has to stop.
No one wants armed police on the streets or check points on every corner, but what other options are there? What can we do differently and is there anything the north could do to help based on our past experience with such organised violence?
Perhaps the road to Irish unity should not be focussed on getting rid of Britain, but on reaching out and helping our fellow citizens, working together for the betterment of our people. And I am not talking about dissidents taking sides and bumping off one of the gangs involved, that would only be adding to the same problem. There has been enough traumatised children on this island. This has to be prioritised over all else.
I would love to see an all island authority on criminality in Ireland, that could replace MI5. I would love to see greater cooperation on this north south with joint funding and joint determination in dealing with all criminality, including dissident republican, loyalist paramilitaries, drug dealing and all forms of organised crime in all parts of this island.
I liked the sound of some of the ideas, saturation policing at a local level. As well as the national crime agencies, there would be units who operate on a local basis, focussing in on individuals 24/7. Their aim to root out serious crime whether it be drugs, paramilitary activity or smuggling.
Should we not be working together on this issue and stop departmentalising this country where one part ignores what is going on in the other?
Perhaps it is time for women to take the lead in Irish politics.
Jessica, An Taoiseach has stated he cannot stop the gang feuds in Dublin. On the one hand, feuds tend to take place in north inner city Dublin, in communities associated with historical and contemporary social and economic deprivation. On the other hand, there is sometimes a less than robust reaction to white collar crime, a tendency which has been fostered by some politicians. Would An Taoiseach have responded with a similar statement if citizens were being shot and cars were being incinerated in south Dublin?
An analysis of prison populations will produce evidence of many young, uneducated males in prison for crimes associated with alcohol or other drug abuse. Available evidence suggests that crime and drug abuse continue to thrive in prisons and the Garda Commissioner appears to have her hands tied behind her back about events dating back to 2007 in Co Cavan. Some politicians and bankers have succeeded in bringing the law, political institutions and civic society into disrepute while contemporary Robin Hoods, hoods being the important word, openly live off ill-gotten gains.
The reality is that many cling to the mistaken belief that crime pays. Some who subscribe to such a view, however, may not be described as being young, uneducated, dependent, vulnerable, unprofessional, substance abusers who are susceptible to peer pressure.
Lolar, there is a real danger that such a pathetic Taoiseach and government response will lead to the normalisation and acceptance of such gangland activity.
The north has been there and thankfully has come out the other side, but I find it difficult to moan about the north while this is happening in our capital city.
This is the real single biggest issue on this island at present. If we turn a blind eye or tolerate such a response from the state, then we are basically giving the green light for mob rule on our streets and encouraging more EU criminals into the fray.
Fine Gael see dealing with this properly as a financial burden, Fianna Fail probably likewise.
This should be treated as a national emergency and guaranteed resources to deal with it sharply and effectively.
Irelands greatest problem is not the amount of money spent on its people, it is quite a high percentage and on paper Ireland should be a socialist country, but it has been led by bankers through Fianna Fail who were lining their pockets while inflating the economy to unsustainable levels in the interest of profits mainly in the property markets.
There needs to be a correction.
I am not a socialist but Ireland desperately needs more left wing socialist projects and a period of adjustment to restore some equilibrium among our people.
Thank you, we certainly need a period of adjustment given we read today, about travelling expenses claimed for ‘lots’ of trips to food banks. In relation to your point about equilibrium, see above, as I would argue that the scales of justice need to be restored to equilibrium.
In relation to the current controversy about An Garda Síochána, the first chapter in the book, ‘The Boss’ (Mr Haughey), deals with some similar historical issues that appear not to have gone away.
“Not enough police on the streets while too many are sat behind desks etc etc”. You know when you read a piece of writing and you have to stop, go back and re-read it because something has nipped at your subconscious? Well, going forward (sic), I want to comment on “too many are sat”. I have never heard an Irish person use this expression. I would say ” too many are sitting”. However I have noticed, going forward, that this is a very English turn of phrase and has become very prevalent or maybe noticeable recently. For people whose diet consists of Anglo Saxon news and comment, it is very easy to pick these things up, going forward. Pedantic rant over. Keep it up ,Jessica.
“I would say ” too many are sitting”. However I have noticed, going forward, that this is a very English turn of phrase and has become very prevalent or maybe noticeable recently. For people whose diet consists of Anglo Saxon news and comment”
When I was at primary school age, I moved house, just about 10 miles away.
The kids at the new school were amused by my calling a window, window. They called it a windy
I could never quite bring myself to call it a windy, but never would have considered it as calling into question my irishness.
I don’t know, you will be giving me a complex fiosrach. 🙂
Aye Jessica …there was a time when we were “kids”..(er …children…) when it was accepted among us to sometimes accept the appelation “chimley” in the stead of”chimney”…and you didn’t have to go as far as the other side of town to hear that one. I think our old fiosrach is just having a jigger of pedantisitis on this one …and anyway ,I’ve pointed out before now that language is constantly evolving as we all soak up influences from around the world .Us 21st century native Irish are actually speaking an evolved version of the English tongue , mixed in with Americanisms and the like, mostly.
What do you want us to do fiostrach? …Wear earplugs ? Ha ha.As a black fellow in an episode of “Justified” that I was watching recently , said…”I’m only axing….”(asking)
“Us 21st century native Irish are actually speaking an evolved version of the English tongue , mixed in with Americanisms and the like, mostly.”
I was always quite good at English, it was Irish I struggled with. Any other languages really.
When visiting Europe a few decades ago now, I was on my own and staying with local people who made an effort to speak English around me, they all spoke multiple languages. We were having a drink in the pub one night and talking about this and how we only had one language. I don’t remember the exact flow but for some reason I pointed out proudly that Ireland did have its own language and was not just English only.
That pride took a nose dive shortly after when I was asked to speak some Irish and to my shame and mortification I was unable to do so.
I have never forgotten that moment even though it was decades ago now.
I went to the local cuman na gaeilge two years running but soon forgot anything learned.
I cant wait for my children to learn Irish and hope that will encourage me to learn a few words.
It is disgraceful that we do not have an Irish language act and that teaching and learning the Irish language is not compulsory in our schools.
‘Black fellow’ ???????
Yes fiosrach …he was a black man…He wasn’t a “high yeller” like Michael Jackson or President Obama .He wasn’t an octaroon either or a “redbone”…and he really had the vocal tic of saying “axe” when he actually meant “ask”…that ‘s a colloquialism , I suppose associated with a less-well grammatically educated man .
You’d need to pull out your old blues and folk records more often and have a good listen to the subtlties and get the feel for the many gradations of society within…
Take the song “The Yellow Rose of Texas,” which originally referred to Emily West Morgan, a “mulatto” indentured servant…a”high yellow” …. or one of my favourite bluesmen ..Blind Willie McTell’s song “Lord, Send Me an Angel” where he’s forced to choose between three women, described as “Atlanta yellow” , “Macon brown,” and a “Statesboro blackskin”….or Bessie Smith’s song “I’ve Got What It Takes” which mentions “a slick high yeller” boyfriend who “turned real pale” when she wouldn’t wait for him to get out of jail…. or the late, great Curtis Mayfield’s song, “We the People Who Are Darker Than Blue” makes reference to a “high yellow girl” In “Big Leg Blues” or the great Mississippi John Hurt sings…. “Some crave high yellow. I like black and brown.” There’s awhole world of distinction to discover there.
I was just wondering why , when you quoted dialect, that you had to add that he was black. Most un-PC. This is common speak in Tír Eoghain even now although becoming rural. I refer you to Marshall’s Ballads and verses from Tyrone. I wasn’t referring to Jessica’s pronunciation but to her grammatical construction. Like “The door wants painting” as opposed to ” The door needs painted”. Anyway as a widely travelled metro you would probably agree that all localisms should disappear into a world of Muddy Waters and Guardian speak. Ils ne passeront etc.
Well fiosrach too much political correctness can stifle all life methinks so I don’t pay much attention to much of it. In the case of the man in question, I was pointing out that the word “axe” seemed to be in colloquial usage as a substitute for the word “ask” only among his fellows in that particular designated class .A lighter coloured person was very likely to disparage this gentleman’s mode of speech as being less sophisticated than someone born to a lighter hue . These things mattered apparently… and possibly still do , to demarcate the various “class” structures among a people .The fact that the man spoke in such a way signalled where he supposedly stood in his society. A more educated or possibly wealthier man would be expected to be educated to a better standard and possibly possess a higher degree of elocution…eh?
As for Jessica’s “the door wants painting”. People really do speak like that and it may not be grammatically correct , but it does possess a loose poetry and as such is perfectly valid.
…also …”metro”….moi? !!! I’m way weirder than that…. Ha ha….!!
No no harry. I’m not saying that it is grammatically incorrect. I am making the point that it has been imported along with Cheers mate, going forward, tick the boxes, blue sky thinking etc Not local not good. Like two people going to London for a month and one comes back talking like a Londoner and one doesn’t. See?
“No no harry. I’m not saying that it is grammatically incorrect. I am making the point that it has been imported along with Cheers mate, going forward, tick the boxes, blue sky thinking etc Not local not good. Like two people going to London for a month and one comes back talking like a Londoner and one doesn’t. See?”
I think the more we stop doing things the way England do things the better.
We need Irish ways and Irish laws for an Irish people, otherwise the little Englander mentality will persist.
As for colloquialisms, you could be right.
One thing annoys me, I listen to RTE Radio 1 when driving on the radio and every time i hit the M2 and have to go glengormley direction, it switches me over to bbc as the signal is lost.
The Nolan show is mindless pap, southern media I find actually more intellectually relevant and I like to know what is gong on over the whole of our country.
I don’t really care about what is happening in the UK.
Why cant we put a bloody transmitter or booster on one of the bloody mountains to reach the other side?
Ach now, fiosrach and jessica…every bit of “Englishspeak” that we all use has been imported anyway. That goes back generations and hundreds of years ….maybe thousands of years . It’s not something i worry too much about because communication is more important than any specific words or language…Yeah..there’s plenty who go away for a week and lose their local accent , but by the same token there can be a whole series of accents and ways of speaking even in a small town or a little village. I wrote a piece about that ages ago that actually garnered vey little response .I ‘ll try and find it on jude’s Backpages …he keeps all this very important stuff in a drawer at the very back of the cupboard, down in the basement of a really old house that has been condemned years ago ….(?)
Oh …hang on …here it is…
http://www.judecollins.com/2016/02/language-please-norneverland/
This stuff seeps into our lives mostly through radio and television. For example when Jessica said …“too many are sat”….that doesn’t annoy me in the slightest because it ‘s just the way many friends that I made while a student in Yorkshire and Lancashire over forty years ago ,spoke casually . You’ll hear it on television in something like “Coronation Street” so it’s no real wonder that phrases like this , used continuously in a popular soap -opera which is watched by a lot of people, should filter into common -speech locally . We all know the difference between slang, bad grammar and so on but we’ll still use it casually among friends where we mightn’t if we’re writing something down. It’s always been happening and now it has speeded up inthe past fifty years or so with television. I’m not so sure that it is worth worrying about .When I first went to Leeds in 1972, I found some of the expressions very old -fashioned and endearing.Some of them harked back to 19th century speech paterns that would never have been used at home and I found that interesting .Some guys would say “thee” for “you” . for example. i thought that was very novel and I hadn’t expected it.
“For example when Jessica said …”too many are sat”….that doesn’t annoy me in the slightest because it ‘s just the way many friends that I made while a student in Yorkshire and Lancashire over forty years ago ,spoke casually”
Is that really an english way of saying too many are sitting or are you guys winding me up?
I am starting to think that the pisseth may be of being taken.
Absolutely not Jessica…It’s totally straight …honest.I haven’t seen “Coronation Street” for many long years but i dare say that if you eavesdropped on an episode or two , you’d hear those Lancastrian phrases popping up.That’s really how they filter into speech idioms..
Ag sodar I ndiaidh na nGall sums it up well ,Harry