“By burying the bodies of the faithful, the Church confirms her faith in the resurrection of the body, and intends to show the great dignity of the human body as an integral part of the human person whose body forms part of their identity,”
You’ll have to excuse me as. i stifle a quiet groan. Sometimes when you’ve waited all day for a bus , two will arrive at the very same time. So it is with news stories where fundamentalist religious beliefs encroach into the everyday world of everyday life , unwanted and unheralded.No sooner has the smoke blown away on the “Gay Cake” debacle where god-fearing pilgrim bakers were afraid of their god’s wrath ,should they have the temerity to bake a specific cake for a homosexual customer whom they reckoned their god mightn’t , of all his creations , actually love at all. No matter that they spent thousands of pounds of perfectly good money pursuing their mad scheme and may even request to spend even more in the High Court in London …and possibly the European Court, they still cling to the belief that god is keeping an eye on them from a golden throne somewhere, elsewhere in the far reaches of the universe ,like some superannuated Wizard Of Oz…..
Now the Vatican has decided to leap onto the same literalist band-wagon, usually preserved only for mad fans of “the Rapture”, awaiting the mass-opening of graves on the Last Day, or crazy American survivalists living in some hole- in -the- ground with enough canned goods to last several generations, preparing for the Second Coming of a saviour of some sort.
The Vatican has issued a statement to the effect that cremated remains of human bodies should be kept in a”sacred place” such as a church cemetery and that ashes should not be divided among family members, nor should they be preserved or built into mementoes such as jewellry .There was time when the Vatican would not allow cremation at all ,in any circumstances ,and also a time when unbaptised babies had to be buried on unconsecrated ground lest they somehow contaninate everyone else ; so it has previous form in laying down some odd laws in the past ,as though we were all still living within some “Hammer” horror or vampire movie.
These days people choose to scatter their ashes at sea or at a favoured spot or garden .Some have even had their ashes shot into space on a rocket or have the carbon re-made as a diamond to keep as a memento, to hand down to future generations. The Vatican is beginning to see these practices as containing erroneous notions about death; possibly sacriligious notions.They do not like the idea that many choose to believe that contained in these practices is the idea that this final fusing with their original nature as dust ,speaks of a total end to life, completely and without a resurrection scenario attached.It’s not the notion they want to express in their teachings, given that they speak of ultimate resurrection as their own proposed direction.
Back in 1963 the Vatican has said that the burial of dead bodies should be the norm.Now they have decided that this new practice of scattering ashes speaks too much of a worship of nature. Pantheism has been mentioned. Apparently the “worship of nature” and such ideas as naturalism and nihilism which asks too many awkward questions have been cited as reasons to further enforce the idea of burial in consecrated ground .
Catholicism and other religions teach that “at the end of days “,god will resurrect the body and an astral ,immaterial portion of that individual, which they call “the soul”,to a new life , to live in some unspecified way, in some “elsewhere”, undefined place ,beyond our known planet earth. Of course they reckon that god is so handily all-powerful that the elements of the individual can be gathered together in any circumstances, whether or not they have been used for spare-parts surgery, or not, for example , or whether the eons had long-since dissipated the very elements of the corpse into the weft and weave of the actual earth of ages past. The church still thinks that if the body is a “sacred” thing , it may not be respected by future ancestors and relatives if it is not buried on consecrated ground.
In past times this didn’t seem to matter one bit , because across the world many museums have the mummified ancient bodies and bones on display in numerous glass cabinets and cupboards for the public to gawk at ….not to mention those donated organs and those bodies and specimens still used in hospitals for medical practice and experiments.
It would seem that the church’s idea is to control life from its very first beginnings until the final outworkings of death.It demands of its followers ,that no “unnatural “method of contraception is used to control the fecundity or otherwise of its adherents and at the same time it opposes the idea of Nature and the natural world as the final arbiter of all things.The church feels it is to do with showing esteem for the dead ,but I’m not sure that it is their real reason.All religions demand a certain amount of control of its adherents but by enforcing such controls it is making itself an ever less- attractive place for its potential followers, in a steadily increasing world population.
It goes without saying that in an overcrowded future , burial of bodies may not be possible at all ,due to a simple lack of space and for possible community sanitary reasons , cremation may become the only viable option.
The world population reached one billion human beings in 1804. By 1927 it had reached two billion and by 1963 when the church made that original statement ,the population number had reached three billion people living on the earth.Since that report ,as of August 2016 the world’s population had reached 7.4 billion and it is reckoned that by 2100 it will stand at 11.2 billion. By those figures it is easy enough to see where we are going. Unless we have a devastating world war or a plague such as the Great Famine of the 1300’s , or another Black Death , to thin out the herd, there’ll barely be room left to bury a cat.With all of that in mind , surely cremation should be encouraged all the more, by whatever methods available, rather than discouraged by the enforcing of even more rules on its practice?
” matter that they spent thousands of pounds of perfectly good money pursuing their mad scheme and may even request to spend even more in the High Court in London”
The case having been heard by the NI Court of Appeal, why would they go to a lower court with no jurisdiction in Northern Ireland?
Keep watching the skies MT…If they request such a route and if such a plea is accepted in the Supreme Court in London , they could be granted a hearing further afield ….not wholly advisible but maybe a possibility, given that they must have been poorly advised in the first place to even take the route they did initially.There was no way they were on the right side of the law and so it proved eventually..Their last words after this current ruling were …”We’ll have to take advice from our lawyers about whether there is a way to appeal this ruling.”..so they may yet joust with even more windmills if they get a greedy enough lawyer to siphon even more money out of their purse..Like i said , do you imagine they;ll get any better treatment anywhere else ?They already have to pay substantial costs and they’ll have to pay even more .
“Keep watching the skies MT…If they request such a route and if such a plea is accepted in the Supreme Court in London , they could be granted a hearing further afield ….”
What’s this got to do with the comment about the High Court in London?
As usual ,MT you appear to understand nothing. I wonder why you bother at all.
“As usual ,MT you appear to understand nothing. I wonder why you bother at all.”
You’ll need to explain why it appears to you from what I said that I understand nothing, and also why you think I usually understand nothing. On what evidence do you base this opinion?
Ironically, it seems to me from what you’ve said above.that you haven’t understood my original comment.
.Are ye talking about “Ashers” or “ashes”. The comments above seem to have no connection to the topic of cremation!
That’s what I thought too, Michael.
I wouldn’t have thought that an emphasis on Christian burial was, leaping “onto the same literalist band-wagon”.
I’m not even convinced that Ashers are guilty of ‘literalism’, or at least how that can be argued from their attitude to the cake.
Unfortunately Harry’s article reads like the usual not-really-very-fond-of-the-Church rhetoric. And that’s all, really.
Why do you assume that the Church wishes to control people?
very few listen to what this gang say anymore and not a bit of wonder some of the fairytales they tell.just another money making scheme to stop people using the crematorium that they cant control.
Hadn’t realised that council cremations were free.
free from luigis control.
And still costs as much – whatever the Church would charge. I don’t know, I’m a Protestant in a denomination which doesn’t charge for burial.
DONATION ONCE AGAIN
With the cost of dying gone sky-high
There’s an exit strat that’s worth a try
As the old ash to ash
Costs a lorra new cash
To the Burke and Hare Research apply
It’s always great to hear from the Mighty Perk , if only to realise that at least one person in the room gets the joke….Yes …Burke and Hare…. recycling operatives , indeed!! Their slogan of business….”Your Past Is Our Future!”…..I can see the billboards now…..
Harry, if you don’t subscribe to the rules, don’t join the club. Why do you, I presume, go to wakes? Or funerals? The logic of your post is the acceptance of weirdos who have plectrums made from Elvis’ bones. In this instance the churches are trying to maintain a sense of decorum and respect. And to die a Christian is free of cost. Surely that is a good thing?
Fiosrach …You don’t get it, do you.? I have no problem with wakes , funerals and all the rest .I’m not like some ultra- Orangemen (Dear help us!) ,who might imagine they might be contaminated by attendance at a ceremony to celebrate a believer’s or non-believer’s birth, death or wedding …in any religious capacity ,or none. Usually it is the family who organises these things and the dead have no input at all ..unless something is stated in a will.I have spoken at funerals and at weddings and have been to baptisms, although admittedly my toes curl a bit at the “demons out” part, ….not believing in demons, ghoulies or ghosties of any sort ,or in any way ,as I do. My grandchild was never baptised , for example, but a lot depends on te society and strictures which people live within , either way. I have inlaws and friends who are of allsorts of backgrounds …Hindus,Atheists, Buddhists, Roman Catholics,Church of Ireland , Presbyterians…..and so on …usually it’s simply a family thing when all is said and done or something they’ve thought out for themselves.
That all said I’m happy enough to let people believe whatever they want and they’re usually happy enough with my presence. Like I say , I’ve read out poems for the dead whom I’ve loved ,told little jokes in their memory , but I’ve also read out poetical tracts from the Bible too if that was wished (the latest current transcriptions available , on hand) but I’m not reading them out as the Word of God…I’m reading those as the poetical imaginings of men, just like you or me …and their personal vision of the world(or a translation of it ) in their long-ago lifetimes.As far as Elvis’s rocknroll bones are concerned…well much of this orbits around a bit of taste or the lack of it, doesn’t it. It doesn’t actually matter at all but it’s a bit like selling pardons for a sliver of the “true cross”.. As for “dying a Christian is free of cost”….I’ve always thought there was a price to pay for everything we do in this life and I haven’t been proven wrong so far.