The Joint Ministerial Council (JMC) will meet today. I suppose you knew that. And you probably knew that this meeting will have a particular edge, because when Theresa May opens the door of No 10 (no, she won’t do it herself, Virginia – when you have a dog you don’t bark), she will be asked some hard questions by Scotland, Wales and the north of Ireland about Brexit.
A couple of reports this morning on BBC Radio Four’s Today programme poked through the entrails of the upcoming meeting. There was no mention of Wales in the report, but that’s not too surprising, since Wales voted with England in the Brexit referendum. Scotland and the north of Ireland didn’t. So you’d expect the Today commentators would have given considerable attention to those two. Not so. There was a lot of mention of Scotland, none at all about the north of Ireland.
That’s because Scotland brings some leverage to the meeting. Nicola Sturgeon has already begun to work at shaping a possible second independence referendum in Scotland. She says it’s one of the options she’ll be putting along with other options (a lot more power for Scotland) to Theresa May. Scotland, if it does hold a second independence referendum, may not get a Yes this time either. In which case the Scots Nat Party will receive a very severe flesh-wound, if not something more lethal. But the fact that an independence referendum will be in the mix will give Theresa May chest pains. It’s called leverage.
Which is why the Today programme didn’t bother talking about the north of Ireland: we don’t have leverage. Yes, an international agreement signed up to by the British government will be put at risk by a hard Brexit. North-south trade will be affected and violent republicanism will be delighted to have been given a series of border targets. But all that ain’t enough. The truth is, Theresa May doesn’t give a damn about this place, as long as we don’t impact on Britain’s welfare.
What’s her solution to the massive concerns both Scotland and the north of Ireland will bring to her gleaming No 10 table? They’ll have a ‘direct line’ to David Davis, who’s the Tory top-cat in charge of the Brexit negotiations. Some newspapers have headlined this as “Theresa May to include Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland in Brexit talks”, which makes you think S, W and NI will actually be part of the team negotiating with the EU. Codswallop. All that will be left to Mother England, and if you think Mother England will put herself out about the deal in terms of S, Wales and NI, you are trusting to the point of imbecility. The welfare of England will come first, last and most of the in-between of negotiations with Brussels.
Theresa will try to pacify Scotland by tossing some further powers to the Scottish parliament. Wales won’t matter, since they have no leverage – not yet, anyway. But Theresa will have to think long and hard about how to persuade Scotland not to have another independence referendum. She’ll probably end up tossing yet more powers the way of Edinburgh. She won’t be remotely bothered about Wales – after all, they voted to leave the EU.
And the north of Ireland? My guess is May will be very relaxed about us. Because she’ll know that Sinn Féin is indissolubly wedded to peaceful politics and the violent section of republicanism simply doesn’t have the firepower to bother the British army. Arlene Foster and Martin McGuinness will emerge from No 10 today with one arm as long as the other. As a faithful British subject, Arlene will probably accept that Mother Britain knows best. Martin McGuinness, as an Irish republican, will be deeply frustrated at his powerless condition.
Brace yourselves, people. Hard Brexit ahead.
Watching QT on BBC last week, Jude, was a deeply frustrating experience. We heard a lot of ‘give us what we voted for- BREXIT’ . Attempts at explanation by Kenneth Clark and a young Polish member of the audience were treated with derision. Neither Northern Ireland nor Scotland was mentioned despite sizeable ‘REMAIN’ votes being declared in both areas. Sturgeon and her team will keep in check those Nationalists who want #indyref2 tomorrow. The Scottish Govt is prepared for as long a game as Theresa May and David Davis want and it is fervently building alliances in Brussels. May wants a special deal for the City of London; Scotland, however, is a much more potent, political force.
we all know they are only there for the photo opps.their feelings of self importance is amazing.
There is something in the water. Plaid Cymru is being urged to put “clear green water” between itself and “a corrupt, stagnant Welsh Labour”, as opposed to “clear red water”, a term coined by Rhodri Morgan, in order to distinguish his administration from that of Mr Blair’s party.
It would appear that Ms May has more than leeks to worry about at present. It may be necessary to force some of her crew to walk the plank as her cabinet is springing leaks at an alarming rate and the crew is contemplating mutiny. Signals from the banks indicate that there is uncertainty about the relationship between the crew and the EC. Perhaps the captain should reflect on the Welsh proverb:
When the steersmen are many, the ship will sink.
if youse in Norneverland, Esteemed Blogmeister, think your outlook is bleak, post- Brexit, do spare a dropeen of sympathy for us unfortunates down here in the Free Southern Southeen..
THE WEST BRIT IS YET TO COME
Up to this he has so far heroically held off
In a sanctimonious odour he’s smelled of
The Rodical Son, roite
Thinks Brexit is shoite
Cead Mile Failte abhaile, Sir Bob Geldof.
I sorry Jude but i dont agree with your last paragraph at all. If a hard brexit means a return to a hard border and people will roll over and accept it – well that simple wont happen.
” If a hard brexit means a return to a hard border and people will roll over and accept it – well that simple wont happen”
Exactly. Expect havoc. I’m not necessarily referring to violence, by the way, there could be civil disobedience. I know I certainly wont be showing my passport in Ireland, not a chance, I’m in my own country, North or South and I’ll travel anywhere I want within it and I encourage others to do the same. Idea was Danny Morrisons, by the way.
You have hit the nail squarely on the head Jude. The most stridently nationalist politician going in to see the great white mother`s government is a Scot. You have to hand it to the Brits.
“Yes, an international agreement signed up to by the British government will be put at risk by a hard Brexit. North-south trade will be affected and violent republicanism will be delighted to have been given a series of border targets”
Dissident Republicans will gather more support if there’s a hard border. The current status quo is already getting them more support, as I mentioned before I spoke to people on Twitter who use to be Pro-SF, now they are Anti-SF because they see the deadlock at Stormont, the pandering to political Unionism and they see no real change at all achieved by either the SDLP or SF. I’m not saying all of them support violence but they don’t support the current political process because its being hampered by the British Government, example: blocking truth and justice, openly siding with Unionists on matters instead of being impartial, etc.
“The welfare of England will come first, last and most of the in-between of negotiations with Brussels”
The South of England only. The Tories don’t give a hoot about the North of England, even Thatcher put that on record when she schemed with her cabinet to let places like Liverpool and Manchester rot in poverty in the 1980’s. So if the Tories don’t give a hoot about the North of England or Scotland, what hope do we poor paddies have in the North of Ireland? I know some would be happy living in a mud hut, uneducated and living off junk food as long as they can wave a “fleg” but most of the people here think better of themselves.
“Theresa will try to pacify Scotland by tossing some further powers to the Scottish parliament”
The only thing left to offer Scotland is Devo Max, which they were going to get in the long run anyway. The North and Wales will be getting the same.
“And the north of Ireland? My guess is May will be very relaxed about us”
She’ll be very silly if she was.
” the violent section of republicanism simply doesn’t have the firepower to bother the British army”
Dissidents are more of a threat than most think. Again all they need is the support, which they currently aren’t getting. Its important to remember the PIRA/OIRA started off in the 1960’s with nothing but World War 1 weapons, that changed dramatically as time went on. They originally got little support but that changed thanks to political Unionism, the British Army and Unionist Murder Squads. Could the same process happen for dissidents? of course. I already stated on here before that I don’t believe the PIRA gave up any of their weapons at all, except maybe old and worn weapons. Indeed last year it was confirmed the PIRA is still in existence and that’s not surprising given the UDA/UVF/MI5 are still openly in existence and being given a free reign to terrorize their own community and peddle drugs. Their commanders are even being paid a tax funded salary. As they say: Collusion is no illusion….
(BTW Jude, Willie Frazer has sworn to “confront” you because of an article you wrote on McCreesh Park a while back, he put up a video on his FB page. I think Willie has forgot to take his meds again, apparently 100 Catholics weren’t murdered by the Glenanne gang. They must’ve just vanished into thin air…..)
the north and midlands of england are the ones she has to cater for as they are the hardest hit with migrants.she will want to avoid trouble if all the promises made arnt carried out in full.some trouble might breakout here and there after brexit once they apply a few new laws banning the burka ect,but that would be about the height of it.
“the north and midlands of England are the ones she has to cater for as they are the hardest hit with migrants”
Have to disagree with you there Billy, according to the statistics I’ve read the South of England has the most migrants. Remember, just because there’s many black and Asian faces in Northern England doesn’t mean they are migrants, they are maybe 3rd generation Asian migrants who came in the 1950’s or 1960’s to Britain. London, for example, is an immigrant majority city, native British people are officially in a minority. There’s more people in London who are foreign born than British born. I cant see why many migrants would go to Northern England given most of the jobs are in the South.
“some trouble might breakout here and there after brexit”
Some? there’s a real chance the UK could break up forever, that’s how big the trouble might be due to Brexit lol I really do see the Scottish nationalists winning an independence referendum this time round. Here in the North a lot more would vote for Irish Unity than the media here would have us believe. Indeed many upper class Unionists who own businesses depend on cross border trade and access to the EU.
“a few new laws banning the burka ect,but that would be about the height of it”
That’s multiculturalism for you, pool a lot of different cultures and values, mix them together and expect a utopia. Of course that’s fantasy. We see here in the North what happens when different cultures, ideologies, etc clash, the reality is a dystopia
“Indeed many upper class Unionists who own businesses depend on cross border trade and access to the EU.”
Upper class unionists? What businesses are owned by upper class unionists?
“Upper class unionists? What businesses are owned by upper class unionists?”
Are you saying there is no Unionists who own businesses and trade with the South/EU MT?…..
“Are you saying there is no Unionists who own businesses and trade with the South/EU MT?…..”
Eh? Of course not. What a bizarre question.
Now please will you name these businesses that are owned by “upper class unionists”.
Ryan? Hello?
Why do you keep referring to the “north of Ireland”. It is only Northern Ireland that is part of the UK. Donegal and other parts of the north of Ireland are not relevant.
The six British administered counties are in the north of Ireland thus the terminology is entirely correct. I’m hope that all six counties in the short to medium term will will be returned to their rightful owners, the Irish, once the full constitutional ramifications of “Scotexit” have their effect.
“The six British administered counties are in the north of Ireland thus the terminology is entirely correct.”
Absolute nonsense. By the same.logic, these counties are in Ireland thus it would be “entirely correct” to refer to NI as ‘Ireland’.
You have a point, MT. In future I’ll be more precise: the north-east of Ireland
“You have a point, MT. In future I’ll be more precise: the north-east of Ireland. ”
Why didn’t you answer the question?
And ‘north-east of Ireland’ wouldn’t be more precise as it would still be a geographical expression, this time relating to less of the jurisdiction thst you’re actually discussing.
“Absolute nonsense. By the same.logic, these counties are in Ireland thus it would be “entirely correct” to refer to NI as ‘Ireland’”
errrr, it is sometimes referred to as Ireland or as part of Ireland MT, ever watch an Irish Rugby game? It includes players from all over IRELAND, including the North and the Irish team is called “Ireland”…..even the Republic’s soccer squad is usually just referred to as “Ireland” and has many players from the North in it, like James McClean, Shane Duffy, Darron Gibson, etc.
Indeed, many English politicians who are involved in politics here are given a lesson on what terminology to use. Tom King, for example, admitted he use to always refer to the North as simply “Ireland” but he had to teach himself to refer to it as “Ulster” or “Northern Ireland” in the 1980’s. Very rarely (if ever) is the North referred to as “Ulster” by the media/politicians anymore, except by Unionist newspapers like the Newsletter.
“errrr, it is sometimes referred to as Ireland”
Really? Could you give some examples of people referring to Northern Ireland as Ireland?
“or as part of Ireland MT, ever watch an Irish Rugby game? It includes players from all over IRELAND, including the North and the Irish team is called “Ireland”…..even the Republic’s soccer squad is usually just referred to as “Ireland” and has many players from the North in it, like James McClean, Shane Duffy, Darron Gibson, etc.”
Neither references to the Irish rugby team nor the ROI football team are references to Northern Ireland.
It makes perfect sense to state that the six counties in question are in the north of Ireland as any good atlas will show you.and will continue to be so long after the man made construct called the united kingdom bites the dust. It will of course be rightfully under Irish ownership again in a politically united nation sooner than one thinks.
“It makes perfect sense to state that the six counties in question are in the north of Ireland as any good atlas will show you.”
If course it does. Just as it makes perfect sense to state that the six counties in question are in Ireland or Europe.
But it doesn’t make sense to call Northern Ireland ‘the north of Ireland’ just as it doesn’t make sense to call it ‘Ireland’ or ‘Europe’.
“Why do you keep referring to the “north of Ireland”.”
Because we want to MT.
” It is only Northern Ireland that is part of the UK. Donegal and other parts of the north of Ireland are not relevant”
Your contradicting yourself MT. Northern Ireland? the North of Ireland? Same thing, really. Norneverland’s proper name should really be “North-Eastern Ireland” if you want to be geographically accurate. As you said yourself Donegal, Cavan, etc aren’t in the UK but are in the North of Ireland or Northern Ireland.
The only politician who seemed to speak plainly to Theresa May today was Nicola Sturgeon.
No one really expected to hear much from the Welsh Carwyn Jones, Arlene, we knew, would make supportive noises, but Sinn Fein!
Has Marty actually joined the DUP? He sounded like it today, more or less echoing the sentiments of Arlene, talking about trying to get the best deal.
Did he forget that NI voted to remain in the EU?
He should have been standing up saying he spoke for the NI majority, that he was not accepting Theresa’s warning to be ‘a good little Brexit boy’, and that he would stand beside Nicola and Scotland, determined not to have us dragged out of the EU.
We cannot blame the English or the Unionists – Sinn Fein, entirely on their own, are dropping their constituents in the manure heap which will be Brexit!
“He sounded like it today, more or less echoing the sentiments of Arlene, talking about trying to get the best deal.”
Trying to get the best deal seems like an entirely reasonable aim.
“Did he forget that NI voted to remain in the EU?”
A majority voted for the UK to remain in the UK. That’s not the same as voting for NI to remain on its own.
“A majority voted for the UK to remain in the UK. That’s not the same as voting for NI to remain on its own”
So if Thatcher gave the vote to the entire UK to vote NI out of the Union you would accept that result MT? Or is this another case of democracy when it suits? (again….)
The people of Scotland and the North voted to remain in the EU, that must be respected. If you think people here and in Scotland will meekly accept their lot, then your very silly.
“So if Thatcher gave the vote to the entire UK to vote NI out of the Union you would accept that result MT?”
Thatcher is dead.
I’m not sure I would have any choice but to accept it, but I would consider it to be an outrageous injustice.
“Or is this another case of democracy when it suits? (again….)”
I’m not aware of any other cases of “democracy when it suits” therefore it couldn’t be another such case. Unlike you In apply principles consistently.
“The people of Scotland and the North voted to remain in the EU, that must be respected.”
As I’ve already explained they voted for the UK to remain in the EU, not for their individual jurisdictions to remain independently of the rest of the UK. There was no vote on the latter question.
“If you think people here and in Scotland will meekly accept their lot, then your very silly.”
Why do you think that? What are you suggesting the people will do? How will they “not accept” -it and why is it silly to think they won’t accept it?
“Thatcher is dead.
I’m not sure I would have any choice but to accept it, but I would consider it to be an outrageous injustice”
Oh right, so its an “outrageous injustice” for a democratic decision to go against your views but its not when it goes against other peoples views that you disagree with? Like people in the North and Scotland voting to stay in the EU but are being dragged out against their will. Is Hypocrisy part of Unionist culture MT?
I know Thatcher is dead but she wasn’t dead in the 1980’s.
“I’m not aware of any other cases of “democracy when it suits” therefore it couldn’t be another such case. Unlike you In apply principles consistently”
I’m not surprised your unaware MT, given you only see what you want to see and hypocrisy flows through your veins just as surely as blood does. There is countless examples of Unionism supporting democracy only when it suits. They were anti-democratic in 1912 when the Westminster wanted to restore democracy in Ireland. They were anti democratic when they gerrymandered here for decades. They were anti-democratic when they refused to accept elected representatives that republicans/nationalists voted for. Most recently they were anti-democratic when Belfast City Hall voted for designated days for flag flying. I could go on. But when democracy goes in Unionisms favour the chant is “Respect democracy!”. The hypocrisy and bigotry knows no bounds.
“As I’ve already explained they voted for the UK to remain in the EU, not for their individual jurisdictions to remain independently of the rest of the UK. There was no vote on the latter question. ”
Well guess what? They want to stay in the EU, they voted that way and that should be respected.
“Why do you think that? What are you suggesting the people will do? How will they “not accept” -it and why is it silly to think they won’t accept it?”
I know your ignorant MT but seriously, read up on the History of politics, even within the last 100 years alone and see how people react when they don’t like something. I’m suggesting people wont accept Brexit, they will use their vote, their voices and their power to stop Brexit if need be, that’s how they wont accept it. How things will fare only the future will tell. Many politicians and economists have already predicted Brexit will end the UK but we’ll have to wait and see.
“Oh right, so its an “outrageous injustice” for a democratic decision to go against your views but its not when it goes against other peoples views that you disagree with?”
Of course not.
“Like people in the North and Scotland voting to stay in the EU but are being dragged out against their will. Is Hypocrisy part of Unionist culture MT?”
To what “hypocrisy” do you refer?
“I know Thatcher is dead but she wasn’t dead in the 1980’s.”
What have the 1980s got to do with anything under discussion?
“I’m not surprised your unaware MT, given you only see what you want to see and hypocrisy flows through your veins just as surely as blood does.”
That’s untrue. I see things that I don’t want to see as well as things that I do want to see; and hypocrisy doesn’t run through my veins. On the contrary my views are entirely consistent and reasonable. Unlike yours.
“There is countless examples of Unionism supporting democracy only when it suits.They were anti-democratic in 1912 when the Westminster wanted to restore democracy in Ireland. They were anti democratic when they gerrymandered here for decades. They were anti-democratic when they refused to accept elected representatives that republicans/nationalists voted for. Most recently they were anti-democratic when Belfast City Hall voted for designated days for flag flying. I could go on. But when democracy goes in Unionisms favour the chant is “Respect democracy!”. The hypocrisy and bigotry knows no bounds.”
I am not “Unionism”. But I take it from your inability to provide any examples that you have no evidence of me supporting democracy only when it suits.
“Well guess what? They want to stay in the EU, they voted that way and that should be respected.”
Lots of people want to stay in the EU but unfortunately the majority voted for the UK to leave.
“Why do you think that? What are you suggesting the people will do? How will they “not accept” -it and why is it silly to think they won’t accept it?”
“I know your ignorant MT but seriously, read up on the History of politics, even within the last 100 years alone and see how people react when they don’t like something. I’m suggesting people wont accept Brexit, they will use their vote, their voices and their power to stop Brexit if need be, that’s how they wont accept it.”
First, the word is ‘you’re’. Second, you’re suggesting merely that non-acceptance will take the form of people voting in elections and talking about it …, and using their “power”. What do you mean by using their “power”?
Marty and Arlene went to London today to represent their constituents in the north of Ireland, a majority of whom voted to remain in the EU.
Representing the majority (the remainders), Marty should have taken the lead in the talks, and rather than meekly go along with Theresa’s admonition that the three areas should not rock the Brexit vote in the UK dealings with the EU, he should have made it plain to the English around the table that he was not there to facilitate the Brexit, but to obstruct it, and that he was fully in agreement with Nicola Sturgeon.
Stand up and be counted for once in your life, Marty!
“Marty and Arlene went to London today to represent their constituents in the north of Ireland, a majority of whom voted to remain in the EU.
Representing the majority (the remainders), Marty should have taken the lead in the talks, and rather than meekly go along with Theresa’s admonition that the three areas should not rock the Brexit vote in the UK dealings with the EU, he should have made it plain to the English around the table that he was not there to facilitate the Brexit, but to obstruct it, and that he was fully in agreement with Nicola Sturgeon.”
Wrong. McGuinness and Foster are equals and therefore neither should have taken the lead. They are obliged to find a common position.
I am fed up with Marty being the support act for Arlene. It is about time SF grew a pair and start representing those who voted for them. SF in the North look too comfortable with the nice wee jobs in Stormont, the very Stormont they once vowed to smash.
Between Marty and Colum Eastwood I am beginning to wonder if we have any “nationalist” leaders to speak off.
Because we want to MT.”
Why do you want to? ”
“Your contradicting yourself MT”
How?
“Northern Ireland? the North of Ireland? Same thing, really.”
They’re not. Northern Ireland is the name.of the political jurisdiction. The north of Ireland is a geographical description relating to more than just Northern Ireland.
Any word on the evidence concerning Gerry’s membership yet, MT, or are we moving on? I can’t wait to evaluate your evidence.
“Any word on the evidence concerning Gerry’s membership yet, MT, or are we moving on? I can’t wait to evaluate your evidence.”
I would expect MT’s “evidence” to be links to Ruth Dudley Edwards columns in the Belfast Telegraph….with some articles by Ben Lowry from the Newsletter on top.
“I would expect MT’s “evidence” to be links to Ruth Dudley Edwards columns in the Belfast Telegraph….with some articles by Ben Lowry from the Newsletter on top.”
Could you explain why fiosraich is asking about Adams?
“Why do you want to”
Because we live in Ireland, specifically the North of Ireland.
“How?”
because you are, read your comment again.
“They’re not. Northern Ireland is the name.of the political jurisdiction. The north of Ireland is a geographical description relating to more than just Northern Ireland”
“Northern Ireland” is a geographic term, Northern Ireland or North of Ireland is basically the same thing in a Geographic sense, hence why I’m correct.
“Northern Ireland” is simply a name for a failed political jurisdiction. But it is first and foremost obviously a geographic term, if you have more difficulty understanding then a dictionary may be useful on researching both words: “Northern” and “Ireland”, hence the Northern part of the island of Ireland. But as I mentioned previously a more accurate term/name for the British administered section of Ireland is “North Eastern Ireland”, as you said yourself Donegal isn’t part of the UK. If Donegal was in the UK then “Northern Ireland” would be more accurate in a political sense.
“Because we live in Ireland, specifically the North of Ireland.”
It doesn’t follow that living in Ireland, specifically the north of Ireland means one wants to refer to Northern Ireland as the north of Ireland. So that is not an explanation.
“because you are, read your comment again.”
That doesn’t answer the question: how was I contradicting myself?
““Northern Ireland” is a geographic term, Northern Ireland or North of Ireland is basically the same thing in a Geographic sense, hence why I’m correct.”
You’re not correct, because Northern Ireland is also a political and legal term and I’m only asking why you use “north of Ireland” to refer to the political and legal jurisdiction. I’m not asking why you use it as a geographical term.
““Northern Ireland” is simply a name for a failed political jurisdiction.”
So contrary to what you said in your previous sentence you now accept that it is a political and legal term.
“But it is first and foremost obviously a geographic term”
Wrong. Its primary, in fact overwhelming, use is to describe the jurisdiction.
But even if it wasn’t, I’m only asking you about its political and legal use. Why can’t you answer? Why can’t you articulate why you refer to the jurisdiction as the “north of Ireland”?
“But as I mentioned previously a more accurate term/name for the British administered section of Ireland is “North Eastern Ireland”, as you said yourself Donegal isn’t part of the UK. If Donegal was in the UK then “Northern Ireland” would be more accurate in a political sense.”
It wouldn’t be more accurate, since Northern Ireland isn’t restricted to north-eastern Ireland. It includes parts of north-western Ireland.
The reality is that Northern Ireland is the name.of the jurisdiction. It doesn’t make sense to say you don’t use the term because you think it is geographically inaccurate, because the name you did use, and about which I am asking, is also geographically inaccurate. So clearly that’s not your reason.
I don’t see the fuss, project reunification should be delighted.
Unionism’s trump card was nationalist apathy and a hard border will negate the value of this card as it will agitate nationalists.
The unionists who voted for brexit are the turkeys who voted for Christmas.
Am G
I agree
Instead of futile protests without clear objectives nationalist/republican leaders should now be planning how to achieve a referendum on unification,
In the next 2 years or so the detail of what Brexit means will become clear and dissatisfaction with how the UK government is handling it will peak.
If any ‘soft unionist’ votes are to be won over that is surely the moment to do it.
That is the time to aim for a vote,but the planning for that should begin now.
Bringing people onto the streets for a campaign that cannot succeed is cynical and manipulative.
Yep, exactly. That’s what I don’t get about the Republicans who contribute here.
Perhaps they can’t read the political signs; perhaps they can’t read between the lines; perhaps, and yes it could be so, perhaps they fear a United Ireland – after all, then it wouldn’t be a romantic ideal, it would be an economic problem to be solved.
I agree Giordanobruno, but then we hear Colum Eastwood enjoining us all to work to support NI. I’m confused. Wouldn’t that appear to run contradictory to this opportunity to show distaste for a hard border. If NI is being accepted as a construct, then the SDLP are going to find it difficult to argue against a border in ideological terms. Mr. Eastwood may have jumped too soon. Certainly work together to improve all of our lots, but make it clearer that NI is only a staging post.
Freddie
Yes that is the contradiction for nationalists and republican.
It applies to Sinn Fein equally if not more. They are part of the government and must be also trying to make Northern Ireland work even if they cannot bring themselves to use that terminology.
It is a difficult balancing act. But it should be possible to work positively on bread and butter issues to improve peoples lives in the short to medium term while pushing for that referendum at some point.
Come to think of it I wonder what the answer would be if we asked a SF minister if they want to make Stormont work?
” then we hear Colum Eastwood enjoining us all to work to support NI. I’m confused.”
No need to be; it’s a means to an end: make NI work and a United Ireland is less of a risk for the RoI.
The only people who have anything to lose are Unionists – and once lost, it cannot be retrieved.
Giordanbruno, I think that Sinn Fein are probably content enough to make Stormont work as it legitimises them further in the eyes of the southern electorate. They could be in government on both sides of the border soon.
Just a small point on Nationalists not being able to bring themselves to refer to NI as NI, rather than the north of Ireland. I think NI does suggest a place apart from Ireland as a whole and therefore the reluctance. It sort of suggests a level of submission, I suppose.
Then of course we have had unionists referring to NI as Ulster for years, which is completely incorrect, or the province, when they really mean NI. We’re all at it. And sure if that’s the worst we’re doing…
Freddie
Agreed up to a point.
SF do need to show the people in the south that they can do government, but if they make NI work too well then why would middle of the road voters vote to change it?
And the party faithful must find it a hard pill to swallow, and all the harder as the years go on.
I don’t know if they will be in government on both sides of the border anytime soon.
Maybe.
Politics has suddenly got very hard to predict.
As for the naming of parts I agree.It is not a big deal and should be treated as light relief.