When are those commentators who keep on writing on this blog and elsewhere about Martin McGuinness and his past going to realise that he was involved in a war which he did not start. When are they going to realise and admit that it was because he was involved in a war with the British as a leading member of the IRA that he was able to persuade the collective leadership of the IRA to go for a ceasefire in 1994 and to negotiate a political settlement with the British. His aim was to stop the war which the British had begun in our country. Martin and others came to the conclusion that republicans were strong enough and confident enough now to take a political path and that would eventually lead towards the goal of a reunified Ireland. He did not think it would be easy but he was prepared to give it his best shot. He believed that in time the case could be made to other republicans and that much political work could be done to bring enough people with him towards that aim. His own efforts at reaching out to Unionism and in particular to Dr Paisley, showed us all how a new political dispensation is possible. As a result of the actions he took and the decisions he made there will be no going back to the ways of violence to achieve political goals. He was instrumental in ‘taking the gun out of Irish politics’ and for that he should be lauded. If some wish to go on condemning him for being in the IRA they can do so but they have missed the point that he who grew up in the Bogside was a peacemaker and will always be remembered as such.
It is because I understand how difficult it was to bring about an IRA ceasefire that I applaud Martin’s achievements. Many others, including Cardinal Tomás Ó Fiaich and the Pope tried in 1979 to no avail. I tried in 1980 to no avail. Martin tried and succeeded not just to bring an end to the IRA campaign but to bring the British to the negotiating table. That was some achievement and I will always admire him for that. The Irish people will always remember his wonderful contribution to a just and lasting peace process on this island.
Some can rant and rave all they like about Martin but they are the blinkered people who will never recognise the truth about what he achieved and they are so mean they will never show any generosity.
Joe
Another one? Must we?
When will you realise that whether McGuinness started his war or not,he certainly played his part in prolonging it.
He was not some helpless pawn unable to control his own actions.
He made choices which involved people losing their lives and he had responsibility for that.
When you do a piece looking at the lives lost or destroyed by the Derry Brigade under McGuinness I will be able to stop challenging your continued hagiography.
It is you wearing the blinkers I am sorry to say.
Gio, same old…same old , the needle is scratching a bit now…perhaps it’s time to say what you really mean !…..Unlike Martin , you will be remembered , very briefly ……do you not get bored with constant repetition….try another angle….or ,
Eolach
I guess I can keep it up as long as Joe keeps his end up.
Truth never sleeps!
Well said Joe. An honest assessment of Martin and his involvment in the conflict and the bigger part in bringing it to an end. A man of the people and Derry people will hold them in their hearts for ever.
Liam
Surely an honest assessment would not omit the lives taken by the IRA in Derry?
Or are they not worth a mention?
It is surprising that Joe McVeigh normally a champion of victims cannot find one word about the victims of Martin McGuinness and his comrades.
Not one word.
GIO, – Possibly you could do a more complete resume of our ‘troubles’ and remember to include British politicians involved in the beginning of the conflict, also British army leaders, RUC, B-Specials, Special Branch, UDR, UDA, UVF and any other British/loyalist paramilitaries I may have neglected to mention.
When you finish that tome, then you may be worth reading!
Sherdy
Do I have to provide a brief history of Ireland every time I want to comment on a particular blog?
The piece by Joe was about Martin McGuinness (again!). My comment was about Martin McGuinness.
Please don’t read my comments or reply to them, I can live with that.
Gio
To use the old joke,it’s “deja vu all over again”! Fr Mc Veigh still continues with his hagiography of Martin Mc Guinness while opting to gloss over some of the grosser outrages for which Martin’s I R A was responsible .I’m happy to be corrected,but I’ve yet to see any expression of condemnation of the Poppy Day bombing in Fr Joe’s own town of Enniskillen .No doubt,as always other S F posters will indulge in “whataboutery ” but I think it relevant that a man of God should not be partial in expressing his disgust at an outrage on his own doorstep .
Argenta
Agreed.
I have no wish to keep repeating myself on the subject, or be accused of ranting and raving.
But if we keep reading gushing pieces about the life of Martin McGuinness which gloss over the rather significant details of his IRA activities then it should always be pointed out.
If Joe McVeigh continues to abdicate his responsibility to speak for victims then someone else will always step up to do it.
He appears to have placed his devotion to the death cult that is the PIRA higher than anything else.
I thought the IRA brought war to Northern Ireland in the 1950s and 1960s with their border campaign. I thought there was a call to arms during the 50th commemoration of 1916 by the leader of the IRA ? All conveniently forgotten in the revisionist narrative.
If it was a war, the Derry brigade and the PIRA in general presided over, and was responsible for, the indiscriminate murder and torture of countless civilians. Do you deny that?
McGuinness only surrendered when he knew the game was up and the PIRA were defeated. He did so to save his own skin.
Yes jb ,that auld chestnut again…for a people “defeated ” we are very proud and confident of our future and the impending re-unification of our country….all Unionism can offer is whinging negativity and.paranoia……you can join us in a new Ireland ,either that or it’s …..well I don’t know , because Britain is imploding at this minute….a has been !for sure
Thanks JB , a very definitive answer…you really cleared that up…you certainly put me , and all defeated republicans in our place…now in your future , how do you see us all , ….you and I , and everyone else in Ireland ( sorry Norn Ireland )… progressing together….is it back to the future , play parks closed and swings tied up on a Sunday . armed mercenaries employed to keep half the population in check , gerrymandered elections and only people of property allowed to vote….what will you do with the LGBT communities and all ” foreigners “…. yes that was the past you offered us and it doesn’t seem like you can offer anyone a brighter future !
“I thought the IRA brought war to Northern Ireland in the 1950s and 1960s with their border campaign. I thought there was a call to arms during the 50th commemoration of 1916 by the leader of the IRA ? All conveniently forgotten in the revisionist narrative.”
=============================================
yeah Revisionism… I asked the BBC to play Sean South.. but they won’t.
Must be a BBC/SF “revisionist” plot.
Juiz Luiz.
Two points.
1 )Do you read your own stuff before you press send.
or 2)do you just think that once you write something. It automatically becomes true.
When you steal and plant land that doesn’t belong to you and continue to harass every generation for 800 years,it is only to be expected that your actions and presence will cause offence and smouldering hatred. If this hatred sometimes breaks out into open war, it is hardly the fault of those being harassed. When the order givers in the British forces receive their medals, promotions and statues for the heartbreak they caused throughout the world, wouldn’t it be in very poor taste if a small voice piped up ” what about the murders”?
The Scottish planters and the Scottish people as a whole are descendants of the Scot tribe that invaded Scotland from North East Ireland and took over from the Picts.
Maybe the plantation of Ulster was just the native people returning home?
History is a funny thing.
Once the Celts give the land back to the Firbolgs, we’ll talk.
Once the Celts give the land back to the Firbolgs, we’ll talk.
==============================================
Is that Official british Policy?
Btw you can keep talking tough but Brit land is on the skids.
It’s on a right Kamikazie Mission.
And it’s extremely doubtful whether they’ll keep up the funding for your tough talk.
Now, I would like to talk to you further
But I am ordering my new British Rover car
And I am going to travel on a British Leyland Bus to collect it.
And the British made car transporter will deliver it to my Local british Austin Rover Dealer.
And I have installed over £4,000 of British Lucas Options on it.
Shame I see to see a lot of German Volkswagens and Japanese Toyotas about.
Still at least I got my British made Television [Grundig ] and British made Radio set. [Sony ]
[Just waiting for the valves to heat up.- It’s why I have time to talk actually ]
Quick Update.
My British made car hasn’t arrived yet.
As the Ship to transport it to Ireland. Hasn’t left Harland and Wolff Yet.
The Koreans can build one £80 million ship in a Month.Every Month
Harland and Wolff can launch 10 ships in 12 years!! [ Do the maths ]
Why are they a TV studio these days.. Why? I don’t understand.[ chortle]
Is the message getting through yet.. Or have I laid it on too thick for Ya.
Decline…decline decline.
it’s all the Orange and brits have to offer.
You know it and I know it.
It’s why you lash out all the time.
So internet Tough Guy.
Smell the Coffee.
something else that’s imported these days.
Ah, but none of them furriners have the Twelfth of July – so that’s us even!
Isn’t it?
what did we do before we started importing coffee? Is there a coffee plantation in the Sperrins I don’t know about?
A little knowledge is dangerous,joe as the Celts were not a people but a way of life.
aye right. keep taking the wee green pills.
One of your better posts.
Good. Answer.
Loyalists will never agree with the Republican view of the late Martin McGuinness and his comrades in the IRA. Same as Ian Paisley, who helped cement the peace after decades of war mongering. Maybe we should appreciate their legacy and be grateful for their last years when they showed what could be achieved by genuine peace makers. The war is over.
AJ
Most people, not just loyalists, do not share (SF)republicans view of Martin and his comrades.
The very small percentage of voters they polled before the ceasefire is evidence of that.
We should appreciate the legacy of those who made peace, including, but my no means exclusively, McGuinness and Paisley, but that does not mean pretending all the other stuff they did never happened.
Most people view Martin McGuinness as a hero. Internationally, he is viewed as a great leader. Obviously his opponents don’t agree, in the same way white supremacists would not view Martin Luther King as a great leader. So, is there a new definition of hero that says a great person must win a majority in every election in their life to be considered great?
Gio,you cannot see that your fundamentalist outlook is stopping you from seeing the world from any perspective than you one you were brought up with.
Emmet
Once again you refer to my fundamentalist outlook without explaining what that means.
Where was the support for McGuinness and his comrades when they were bombing and killing their fellow Irishmen women and children?
SF bumped along on 10 or 11 % until the middle of the 90s.
If you want to rewrite history in your imagination I can’t stop you but the facts are out there. Why not look at them.