The Brexit vote left Theresa May looking like a woman who has been persuaded by vociferous friends that she should climb to the top of a tall building and throw the baby off it. Why would she be persuaded that such a course made sense? Because once set free from the constraints of architecture and gravity, the child will flourish.
Yesterday’s announcement that the matter of Brexit should be decided by Parliament has sent the British tabloids into inter-planetary over-drive. These three judges who declared that Parliament is sovereign are “ENEMIES OF THE PEOPLE”. It’s tempting to think that if these Brexiteers are annoyed about something, that means there’s now hope the whole Brexit deal could be reversed.
Big mistake. The vote by Parliament is being presented as a vote on how the UK leaves the EU – under what terms – not on whether the UK should leave or not. There’s much talk of withdrawal being a done deal, since the people have spoken. In which case what’s getting the Brexiteers frothy-mouthed is that Brexit is not happening today or better still yesterday. They are also fearful that delay may mean postponement which ultimately might mean cancellation.
Stop worrying, guys. The SNP has declared that the Brexit decision is irrevocable, the Labour party is fearful that people might see them as contemptuous of the people’s decision, the DUP is all for getting out of Europe. I suppose we should be grateful that the baby-tossing won’t happen immediately, and that MPs will arange so that the baby, when launched, will have as gentle a journey downwards as possible. In the end it’ll still be killed or horribly maimed, but at least we’ll have the satisfaction of knowing that the people and Parliament were as one in arranging for everything possible to be done for the infant as it finally leaves the building.
MAY DAY ! M’AIDEZ ! MAY DAY !
Oh, dear, oh, drat ! that over-dressy Tessy
Has gone & D.I. made a non-Lionel messy !
Will May-oman Enda
A hand to her lend-a?
From a Southern Yune one expects no lessy.
The baby will need all the help it can get. On 7 July 2014, Theresa May, then Home Secretary announced a public inquiry into child abuse. The inquiry has lurched from crisis to crisis. The lead counsel to the inquiry has been suspended over disagreements about the remit of the inquiry under its fourth chair. The Shirley Oaks Survivors Association, has also raised issues about the independence of the inquiry.
Like baby Brexit, we are in a state of suspended animation with architecture and gravity leading to the creation of a few more arch enemies.
“The inquiry has lurched from crisis to crisis. The lead counsel to the inquiry has been suspended over disagreements about the remit of the inquiry under its fourth chair. ”
The so called crisis in the said inquiry is by design not accident. Just like previous inquiries such as Bloody Sunday, hillsborough, Iraq etc the stalling and hindering is par for the course especially when the British establishment has something to hide. If it was an inquiry into Putin etc you would find that the inquiry would be done quite speedily.
It does my rebel heart a power of good to witness the wailing and gnashing of teeth currently coming from the direction of little englanders. Mrs May is a glory hunter, her team lost the referendum and now she supports the winning team. The longer this goes on the better, I have never known democracy in my country so making those people suffer a little feels good.
So, Jude, you oppose the RoI’s membership of the EU?
Emm. Yes.
Now remind me, those of you who can, what the point of an Independent nation is.
I seem to recall reading some Irish writers’ thoughts on the matter – 7 of them at least.
Something about flag and freedom.
And unfettered control of one’s destiny… and that being sovereign and indefeasible.
Yes, “indefeasible”.
Unless, of course, unless, those rights were to be be extinguished by the Irish people, themselves.
Yes, that would be it.
Unfettered control of one’s destiny… extinguished, like the image of Lady Lavery fading on a 1970’s note, first to a watermark and then entirely, in 2002.
Ah, Erin…
Long live the EU.
PF, never fear, some of us did express a desire to leave the EU. Alas the tumbleweed took the legs from under us!
Wolfe tone,
Actually, and this may surprise you, but it pleases me to hear that, and not for the reasons you might think.
It is precisely because I am a Unionist that I can respect your desire for a free and independent Ireland. My own hope would be for a re-United Ireland re-united with our Anglo-Celtic neighbours in equal partnership and for our mutual benefit; while, and at the at the same time, each nation was also free to retain a sovereign Parliament and identity. That’s what the Union always should have been.
The EU, however, is entirely different. Nations are increasingly expected to relinquish sovereignty to another Parliament, to another judiciary and another currency; and especially for smaller nations like Ireland, that cannot be a good thing.
And that is also why the delight expressed on these pages at Britain’s current constitutional crisis is not only bemusing, but disappointing. That Irish Republicans might take delight in the possibility that Britain might not escape the EU, simply, it seems, because they do not like Britain is a contradiction beyond belief. And one which is compounded as the same Republicans express support for the very non-national bureaucracy which would steal, and has stolen (and that at the ballot box) their sovereignty and freedom.
Funny thing is this, I’m not an Irish Republican, but they’re not really Republicans either.
PF, it pains me to say it, as I don’t like to give credit to the ‘enemy’ and all that, but I have a sneaky admiration for the way the British people have stood up to the overwhelming propaganda and bullying of the EU cheerleaders. Whether people like it or not every country/people has the right to determine their own affairs and republicans must respect that right. I don’t have any proof but common sense tells me that 17 odd million didn’t all vote brexit due to immigration. It’s lazy of people just to label all brexiteers as racist. In fact it insulting.
Yes there is no doubt racists were cheering on the brexit side but that doesn’t mean every last one of them or indeed the majority of them are racist. I am big enough and hairy enough to admit there are people who call themselves Irish republicans are racist and sectarian. I am also hairy enough to admit the Irish people have there fair share of racists. I also believe that the EU is littered with racists. So to lump all those who want to leave the EU as bad and those who want to stay as good is deeply flawed.
I will admit I selfishly participated in a ‘British referendum’ and voted leave in the hope that a brexit would jolt the UK and especially people in Ireland to deal with the question of partition. I am personally enjoying listening to free staters bleating about unfair the brexit is on them. For years they pontificated(no pun intended) how all of us in the ‘black north’ were whingers and indeed irrelevant. Their bleating has exposed their hypocrisy and greedy selfishness. They are now talking about the border like never before and to me, although maybe not you, that’s a good thing. It really does make a change from republicans bleating on about partition and being met with rolling eyes and tuts. Now I roll my eyes when I hear them complain about the border. In fact I afford myself a wry smile.
Where I differ from others perhaps concerning the border, is that I don’t believe Irish unification should happen just so that we can be part of the EU. I also wouldn’t be averse to sharing closer ties with the countries of Britain, I will however object to anything Royal being part of those ties. Sorry but that’s a no go for me.
Just on another footnote, I don’t gain any satisfaction when folk mock and ridicule unionism for their stance regarding abortion, same sex etc. I respect and again it pains me to say it, admire their stance. They believe in what they believe. I would ask Irish republicans would they accept Irish unity if that meant they’d drop attempts to legalise abortion? There’s a sizeable chunk of people in this land who don’t want free abortion and their beliefs should be respected not ignored. Ignoring and overriding people’s views won’t speed up unification imho.
Wolfe tone
I was beginning to think that there were no Irish Republicans left, that all had become converted to centre-left EU supporting Liberals.
If I were a Republican, to gain an open border, tax parity with the RoI, increased harmonisation, and rights to vote for TD’s and a President – even if it lead to a re-unification treaty – would be a hollow victory if it ultimately meant the loss of my nation to the EU.
Sinn Fein, however, strike me as having this policy. It is as if they seem to think that they can use EU membership to forge a United Ireland, not realising that membership of the EU leads to end of nationhood.
On another point, I found this interesting:
“I also wouldn’t be averse to sharing closer ties with the countries of Britain…”
For me, the merit of a United Ireland in some kind of cooperation/union (small ‘u’) of the Isles is too often overlooked. Ireland, Scotland, Wales, the Isle of Man, Cornwall and England have sufficient in common to make it work.
And each part could retain their identity as a free and equal sovereign partner.
I’d have thought that was preferable to being an EU appendage.
“For me, the merit of a United Ireland in some kind of cooperation/union (small ‘u’) of the Isles is too often overlooked. Ireland, Scotland, Wales, the Isle of Man, Cornwall and England have sufficient in common to make it work.”
Well that’s sounds like a better plan than the alternative were we are supposed to believe that Catholics will simply out breed(which btw is a sectarian outlook) and therefore have the numbers to out vote a section of our people despite their concerns and worries. If establishing closer ties with scotland,England etc helps alleviate concerns and worries of those of a unionist persuasion, about Irish unity, then it most definitely should be explored.
Alas I am afraid the irony is lost on a lot of people who champion the EU. Perhaps blinded by their own selfish interests they fail to recognise that the EU has in effect removed democracy from Ireland. Has removed the right of the Irish people to control its own affairs. When the EU was bearing gifts like new roads and financial grants etc the recipients failed to recognise these were not gifts but bribes. And with all bribes you have to give something in return.
This is a great and fruitful exchange between you and Wolfe Tone, PF. I wish we had more of this type of intelligent and constructive exchange between people with different political viewpoints in this fair isle of Ireland.
“These three judges who declared that Parliament is sovereign are “ENEMIES OF THE PEOPLE”
How could they be? they are simply implementing the law, the same law made by the politicians that the PEOPLE voted into parliament.
“that means there’s now hope the whole Brexit deal could be reversed.”
I think if another referendum was held that a majority of around 70% would vote to stay in the EU. That’s just my opinion anyway. Why? because I think the economic and political shocks that have occurred after the referendum has frightened the public in Britain, including those who voted Brexit. I really do believe many people have changed their minds because of the unknown. There’s a reason why UKIP’s Nigel Farage quickly retired after the Brexit vote…..like a rat jumping from a sinking ship…..
Tony Blair thinks so too. I read an article recently where Tony Blair said there should be a 2nd referendum. He said that many people HAVE changed their minds and that such an important and huge matter as Britain leaving the EU should be reconsidered and the public should be given the opportunity to change their minds if they want to. Blair also pointed out the massive economic and political dangers of brexit, he pointed to how Banks in London are getting ready to move to the likes of Dublin or Frankfurt, along with all their cash. Blair pointed to the SNP and the border in Ireland, and the very real dangers to the existence of the United Kingdom itself, despite what Theresa May (or Arlene Foster/DUP) says.
” the Labour party is fearful that people might see them as contemptuous of the people’s decision”
Its rumoured that Jeremy Corbyn himself is a secret brexiter. I cant see Westminster stopping Brexit. The SNP maybe wouldn’t want Brexit stopped because this situation has brought about the 2nd opportunity for an Independence referendum which most consider inevitable. What can Westminster promise Scotland this time round in order to stay in the UK? They already promised many more powers before during the 2014 indy referendum. A House of Lords Committee has already recommended Devo Max for all UK regions, thus effectively making the UK a loose Federation. Maybe the UK’s name should be changed to the: “Not So United Kingdom” or the “Very Loose United Kingdom” lol
“lol”, Ryan? Really?
Are you an Irish Republican or a supporter of the EU?
You cannot be both.
““lol”, Ryan? Really?”
I don’t know what your referring to PF……
“Are you an Irish Republican or a supporter of the EU?”
I voted brexit PF. I will admit I wanted the current situation we’re in to develop because it makes our politics a lot more interesting. With the North and Scotland voting stay in the EU and England/Wales voting to leave, it really does cause serious issues and as many have predicted: a possible break up of the UK. Such vast differences in opinion North and South in Britain will be extremely difficult to reconcile. The UK is already heading towards a Federation system, Westminster could be reduced down to 100 MP’s and have powers only over Foreign relations and the Military. In that case Scots will be so independent already that many will ask…..what’s the point? why not just go full Indy? Many thought devolution in Britain in the 1990’s would destroy any notion of Scottish Independence, they were wrong. All this isn’t taking into account the growing call from the English for their own Parliament and more say over where their taxes go. Very bad news for NI, given the block grant. We’ll be getting tax powers anyway and will need to raise our own revenue.
I’m an Irish Republican, I’m anti-EU but I WOULD support the EU if it was simply an economic block, not political but I know that’s very unlikely to happen given the whole point of the EU is an EU super state or a United States of Europe. So yes, I agree with you to a certain extent that you cant be both Pro-EU and Pro-Irish Republican. I suppose the same thing could be said about being a Unionist, you cant be Pro-EU and a British Unionist but there again there’s different types of Unionists, Pro-Devolution Unionist, Anti-Devolution Unionist, etc. Maybe some Unionists will disagree with me on that one but that’s for them to explain.
Ryan
“I don’t know what your referring to PF……”
It was a straightforward question; one you answered: “I’m an Irish Republican, I’m anti-EU”
As I said to Wolfe tone, I can respect that view.
What I don’t get, and you have a bit of circle squaring to do, is the ferocity of delight taken in the British constitutional crisis.
I agree with you that the UK Union is in more peril than ever. And this incidentally, is one of the reasons I do not believe, and have never believed it when Unionist politicians and Unionist commentators told me that Northern Ireland’s place in the Union is safe.
But, while Britain’s peril is obvious, the Irish Republican goal of an Ireland as envisioned in the Proclamation is as far away as ever. Partition, whatever our respective views on that, even if overcome in a re-Unted Ireland in the coming years (and I think that possible in some form or other), will not lead to a sovereign, free and independent Ireland. That hope is gone; the EU has seen to that.
And that is not something I take delight in, anymore that I look forward to the further decline of the British Union.
In truth, all of it is regrettable. And for these reasons, I also pity the sham of independence that the SNP are offering – it is nothing of the kind.
A once great Nationalism, be it Scottish, Irish, Ulster-Scot, Welsh, or English, has gone; and oddly enough, with a degree of hindsight, handled correctly, a free and equal Union of the British Isles could have been its greatest safeguard.
Be careful what you wish for.
And BTW, yes, you are correct, Ulster British Unionism, is incompatible with the EU.
““These three judges who declared that Parliament is sovereign are “ENEMIES OF THE PEOPLE”
How could they be? they are simply implementing the law, the same law made by the politicians that the PEOPLE voted into parliament.”
It certainly appears the you are correct about British law and constitution: referendums in the United Kingdom are not generally binding, although it depends on the relevant legislation.
Having said that, the two statements above are not necessarily in conflict with one another, and that dimension of the continuing Brexit debate is the greatest part of the dilemma.
Why, because it is patently obvious that those who seek, in this instance, to assert the sovereignty of the Westminster Parliament, also oppose Brexit.
Personally, in recognising Parliament as sovereign, I think that the outcome of the referendum should be brought to that House; but it is also clear that there are those who hope that Parliament will overturn the expressed wishes of the people.
Democracy, it seems, is now a matter of winning an losing rather than gaining consensus, and that cannot be good for democracy.
“Why, because it is patently obvious that those who seek, in this instance, to assert the sovereignty of the Westminster Parliament, also oppose Brexit.”
Your maybe correct PF but those Judges are obviously enforcing the law, just like the Judges in Belfast who dismissed a case from Raymond McCord and a group of politicians (SF/SDLP/Alliance and the Greens) who tried to block Brexit. They are taking their case to the Supreme Court now. So its really irrelevant whether those Judges in London oppose Brexit or not, there’s Laws in the books that state Parliament have sovereignty, the same Parliament that is full of people democratically elected by “THE PEOPLE” as the article referred. Those Judges merely highlighted those laws.
“Personally, in recognising Parliament as sovereign, I think that the outcome of the referendum should be brought to that House; but it is also clear that there are those who hope that Parliament will overturn the expressed wishes of the people”
As Jude said, you have nothing to fear. The Labour Party is very unlikely to vote against Brexit now and even said such. The SNP said Brexit is inevitable for England and Wales. The only way Scotland can avoid it is Independence. Martin McGuinness has said he has no hope MP’s will respect the wishes of Scotland and the North, in other words the Judges ruling means nothing for Pro-EU voters.
So whilst you may see it as MPs/others working against the wishes of the majority in opposing Brexit, those that are Pro-EU in Scotland/NI see it as England/Wales dragging them out of the EU against their will because clear majorities in Scotland/NI voted to remain. Hence the irreconcilable differences between the North and South in Britain today that could very well lead to the break up of the UK as I mentioned previously, such divisions will be extremely difficult for Unionists for reconcile, if that’s even possible. Already many Scottish Celebrities, such as Ewan McGregor, is backing Scottish Independence despite the fact he opposed Scottish Independence in 2014! Its all because of Brexit.
“Already many Scottish Celebrities, such as Ewan McGregor, is backing Scottish Independence despite the fact he opposed Scottish Independence in 2014!”
But it isn’t independence.
It’s merely (and at best) a vote to take Scotland out of one Union and into another.
William Wallace this ain’t.
Beyond that, you missed my bigger point: “Democracy, it seems, is now a matter of winning an losing rather than gaining consensus, and that cannot be good for democracy.”
A bit, I suppose like the idea of Scottish Independence – that kind of ‘independence’ isn’t good for the notion of any nation’s independence, nor does it do much for the idea of nationalism.
Scottish Independence is, as we might say, ‘a pig in a poke.’
scotlands referendum will have to be treated the same way if they win,if parliament is sovereign.same as a border poll here.