The whale is safe. That big, blubbery, water-spouting mammal which is a wonder to behold (although not of much use to most of us in the average day or week) will not be allowed to become extinct. And wouldn’t it be appalling – a crime, in fact – if it did? I’ll come back to the whale.
In the past four days I’ve attended two events which show that the Irish language movement is two-faced ( in the best possible sense). On Saturday last the young, vibrant, confident, unstoppable face was on show, as thousands upon thousands (VO please note: not just ‘over 1,000’) walked from the Culturlann on the Falls Road to Customs House Square. I was standing at Customs House Square as they came down and it was like watchin g a river of red noise coming straight at you. Old people, middle-aged people, young people, in red t-shirts, carrying red banners and front-line posters, chanting and singing their demands for the Irish Language Act as promised in the Good Friday Agreement,. They came swirling round and past me to the stage set up in Customs House Square. The place was a lake of red, raw, youthful energy.
The other face of the Irish language was on show in Belfast City Hall last night. It was organised by An Ciste Infheistíochta Gaeilge (The Irish Investment Fund). It’s a body that was established after the Hillsborough talks and it manages an £8 million fund. Its job is to dole out the money to Irish groups that can make good use of the money to provide and develop services which will benefit different communities throughout the north. Three flagship projects: A Derry academy of excellence in music and Gaeilge in the aftermath of the hugely successful Fleadh in that city; a new Culturlann-type facility in the centre of Armagh; and a new purpose-built Irish-medium radio station in Belfast with its aerial mast (oh the irony of it!) maybe located on the to of Divis Tower. Ciste helps with funding for these enterprises, and the bodies involved then are in a position to approach other potential funders and get their added support.
This was the organised, efficient face of the Irish language: finding ways to help the communities in which it is developing, building on success by drawing in wider support for the Irish language.
I remember someone once saying that in the early days of rioting, Gerry Adams would always ask the question: What will we get from doing this? The same thought crossed my mind at Saturday’s Dearg le Fearg parade: is all this youthful energy going to have an end-result, or will it just sparkle in the sun for a few hours and then melt away? Yesterday’s Ciste event gave the answer. Funding is being provided to produce more funding, local aspirations for the language are emerging in buildings and facilities, the Dearg le Fearg dream is putting down firm roots throughout the north.
They call this second face of the Irish language Ciste, meaning a fund. It’s more than that – it’s Ciste cliste – a clever fund.
And no Virginia, I haven’t forgotten about the whale. Gearóid O Cairealláin, when asked once what use the Irish language was, replied by asking his questioner to consider the whale. A massive beast but not something that is of essential use in the lives of most people. But if someone suggested we let the whale become extinct, we’d be horrified. All that bigness, all the complicated beauty! Think similarly about the Irish language. What fools we would be, to let something so massive and glorious and complex and beautiful slip through our hands and be forgotten.
But thanks to the youthful energy of Dearg le Fearg and the level-headed organisation of An Ciste Infheistíochta Gaeilge, the whale is safe. It’s up to the rest of us, in small ways and big, to see it stays that way.
How’s the Ulster Scots getting on? I value the remnants of it in my daily speech just as much as I like to hold on to my cupla focail but, apart from seeing the slightly comic chunks of Lallans used in public notices, I don’t hear anything about efforts to promote it at conversational level. Is the Ulster Scots an exclusive club or can anyone join in?
mmm SF administers the DCAL brief in Stormont and has not delivered on the Irish Language act oh the wonderful irony!
http://sluggerotoole.com/2014/04/12/sinn-fein-to-the-fore-for-the-photo-to-the-rear-of-the-movement/
This maybe of some interest to you.
Neill,
SF has the DCAL brief and hasn’t delivered the Irish Language Act?
So you blame SF ( who have done more for the language than any other political party ) for bigoted unionists vetoing the Act when SF try to enact it? Pathetic.
So you blame SF ( who have done more for the language than any other political party ) for bigoted unionists vetoing the Act when SF try to enact it? Pathetic.
No I blame them for wrapping themselves around a language which puts a lot of people of it and makes it a political football
So SF should have shown no interest in their native language so that others could show an interest in their native language? I guess that’s logical…
By wrapping themselves around Irish they have made it a political fooball can you see the logic there?
Is ‘wrapping around’ the same thing as ‘promoting’?
Far from it SF has always used the Irish language for its own political end always have always will and thats sad for ordinary people who love the language would love to see their unionist neighbours take an interest in the language but why would they when they see SF `wrapping` themselves around the language?
Hmmm, so Neil takes exception to an Irish political party promoting Irish?
Tell you what, Neil, why not just take control of that language yourself to “unwrap SF” from it.
It’s a poor excuse for Unionists not to embrace An Teanga. Another in a long, long line of poor excuses.
Thats the problem they dont promote the language they use it for their own political needs you seem to accept that
No Neill, you’ll find that your idea that SF somehow have stolen the language for thier own ends is a false premise. It is based on soundbites agus unfounded accusations. The groups who promote the language are not at the back and call of SF in relation to the language, it just happens that they agree that the rights should be forthcoming. If you use SF as your excuse to deny Irish speakers their rights to use their language then it is you who is using the language as a political tool, not SF.
Neill, what on earth are you talking about? ‘Wrapping themselves around the language’, ‘using it for their own political needs’? The first statement is impenetrable, the second raises the question of what use do any of us make of language but to meet our needs? SF being a political party have political needs, ergo… Is it that you think they have infected the language by using it? Dear me…
Jude SF could order the death of every first male child in Northern Ireland and you would try to find a way to defend them.
If you want to promote Irish in Northern Ireland as a second language in Northern Ireland getting SF to promote it will be a complete and utter disaster even amongst the most moderate unionist.
Whilst I do take Neil’s point about the risk of Unionist’s being turned off the language by a belief that Irish= Sinn Féin, it does leave me wondering precisely which political parties are supposed to promote the Irish language other than those which seek the establishment of an Irish-speaking Republic? If Sinn Féin were to campaign for the establishment of an independant, yet culturally utterly anglophone and anglicised Ireland which slavishly followed ‘British’ for want of a better word, English-language culture, I think people might well ask precisely what the point was.
No Mary Jo, Ulster Scots is not an exclusive club.Its so inclusive that I understand every word of it .I never had to attend classes or anything -just travel a few miles across the river Bann. (Don’t tell anybody but Ulster Scots is really only English spoken in a Ballymena accent!)
Finally reading something that makes sense to me. As an Irish speaker myself i find that sf are the only political party that support our language. They have invested £20m into Irish education and not forgetting the líofa challenge yet ironically seem to get slandered by our own Irish language community. What about questioning the parties that put every obstacle in our way in regards to the Irish language, the ones that would rather it was never spoken.. Just a thought!
Gan amhras!
Whatever one’s thought about SF, they have done great work PROMOTING the language.
Nice one Michael C dead on true
Seachain bhur dteanga.
Guys
Look.
Surely the fact that we’re always hearing from unionists (myself included) that SF’s association with the language puts people off would cause some of the more inquisitive types to take note and listen?
THAT perception is a truth.
Palming it off with “an Irish party promoting Irish” or “well, SF endorse shoes and education too!” or “unionists are bigots” is merely a distraction.
If you are armed with this knowledge and have a true love of the language then surely you have an obligation to investigate this matter?
There might be some truth in the matter (loads in fact, but I know youse won’t listen to me or Neill ).
And what do you do if you discover SF’s association IS harming the language (in terms of acceptance by Protestants)?
Unionism (bar NI21 arguably) is in a tail spin as they refuse to listen or adapt.
The automatic heel-digging in the defence of SF’s use of Irish makes me think that nationalism can be equally blinkered.
There, I said it.
Now, either listen to such views, investigate it and mull it over or just stick your fingers in your ears and go “la la la la!” as that’s what I’m reading in the comments above.
Now that’s what i call a good full-blooded contribution, AG – thanks for it. And I hate to say I can’t agree with it. It’s one thing to acknowledge that unionists (say they) are alienated from Irish by SF’s use of it; it’s another thing to say that’s SF’s fault. If I tell you your wearing blue socks makes me really nervous, you’d probably acknowledge my nervousness but you’d still see it as a problem I had rather than you. Likewise with Irish. It flies in the face of common sense to say you’re put off Irish because some group of other people are using it. Like saying you won’t learn Russian because Stalin used it or German because Hitler used it.
Ok, Am Ghobsmacht, let’s follow through the logic of your thinking, that SF using & promoting the language puts people off it.
Thus SF quit using & promoting the language.
How can they promote Irish self-determination, including the flourishing of Irish culture, but studiously avoid the indigenous language? Indeed, why should they?
That’s awfully close to the UUP & PUP complaint at the height of the flag protest that “SF are now just using politics to further the same goals they’ve always had” (I heard it first-hand & was astonished). I mean, whaa??!
What else would they be doing? Why else would they exist?
I think our venerable salon facilitator, Mr Collins, is closer to the mark, above when he asks Neill if the problem is, in unionist eyes, that SF speaking the language has ‘contaminated’ it. If that is the case then the problem is not SF speaking the language, the problem is SF existing.
I think that is the problem for most of political unionism. They simply have not come to accept that SF have the right to exist & promote their policies. Thus IRA violence was politically useful to unionism because opposition to it was a no-brainer for ‘right-thinking people’ & helpfully obscured the much less tenable position of opposing the right of SF goals to exist & be as valid as unionist goals.
Hence the unionist ability to lump GAA jerseys & the langauge 7 ‘terrorism’ in together. Anything Irishy is a bit SFy & a beyond the Pale. Isn’t this the separatist supremacist logic that necessitated partition?
People are talking about SF and their efforts to promote the language as politicising the language – why wouldn’t they? The Irish language is without question an important political issue that needs to be addressed (as evidenced by the massive crowd that marched the streets of Belfast at the weekend). The fact that other parties fail to effectively address this political important issue is no reason to criticise SF for their efforts.
Other than a few individuals within the party, SDLP continue to virtually ignore the language as a political priority and this opens the door for opponents of the language to criticise SF for party-politicising the language. The incredible irony is that the SDLP can then feel that they have a moral right or mandate to criticise SF for a lack of effectiveness in promoting the language in government.
SDLP have the opportunity to de-party-politicise certain people’s perceptions about the language but continue to fail to do anything about it – year after year the language fails to be a priority in their manifesto commitments, as they continue their slide towards irrelevance. Alasdair is obviously happy to leave all the heavy lifting on this issue to Linda Ervine.
Jude et al :
This paranoia about the irish language by some unionists really came to a head when a certain eccentric strain began to suddenly promote Ulster -Scotch as a sort of antidote by some.Nobody had even heard of it until a few years ago….
They needed a language to identify their separateness from the rest of their fellow Irishmen who they considered used the Irish language as an identifier, so they cobbled together a “language” from a dialect of English, in opposition that they hoped would identify their difference..
I think that although many of the local colloquial words we use unthinkingly are a mixture of old Gaelic and bastardised English,…..{ Down the loning ….into the sheugh….} it hardly constitutes a separate language.Of course every language , as a tool of communication is constantly developing and new words are being added to the dictionaries annually….{take “texting” as one example of a new word}
The dividing line is apparently that in Catholic/Nationalist schools it’s been the norm {certainly in my lifetime } to be taught Irish alongside, English Grammar and English Literature, Latin and French.That obviously was not the case in “State” schools so those scholars are coming to the party very late in the day so they fail to understand that Nationalists simply see the Irish language as the old language of Ireland.Of course we all know that the majority of us have spoken english from the nursery on….
Irish should be promoted and taught to anyone who wants to learn it and as Irish people we should all have some awareness of its origins whether or not we use it daily .It is part of an all round education in communication.
In another generation there will be a society here comprising , Russians, Poles , Italians and Lithuanian families, bringing their languages and cultures to play and add even more new words to the melting pot. The way we speak now will be seen as quaint in another few generations, just as we’d struggle with Milton or Shakespeare..
.
These people arguing about the politicising of a language need to get out and get a life ….listen to the passing conversations on our own streets and in our shops….What languages are they speaking out there? Most of the conversations are not in English at all. In fact some of the ones speaking English from birth here have less grasp on their own “English” language than those foreigners blowing in from Europe, who possibly already speak three or four languages already..
It’a whole new world….
Unfortunately there is the whiff of snobbery from some quarters when using the irish language. We had/have irish nationalist gaelgeoiri who have used their ability to speak the native tongue as a way to mock republicans ie i am more irish than you;you cant even speak irish! Now republicans have got smart and are embracing their language the irish nationalist is losing the ability to ridicule irish republicanism. I am no fan of sinn fein but even i can accept that they have promoted the language more than any other party on this island.
I attended the rally in belfast on saturday and i had a conversation with an individual who said that ‘people were put off learning irish because republicans had hijacked it during the troubles’. I disagreed but yet again realised how deep anti irish propaganda can reach.
I would ask any supporter of the irish language does it really matter who supports it or do certain people want it for themselves? Surely arguing over sinn feins attendance takes the spotlight off the aim of the march itself?
I agree with the point u made about snobbery. I work within the Irish language community myself & also see that snobbery & agree with your comments in regards to that however I will answer your question and say it doesnt matter who supports it, get everyone to support it, thats exactly what we want! Was great to see Sinn féin attend and support hence my confusion as to why some people from the Irish language community chose to slander that instead of embracing it! As i said on previous comment, they’re the only political party delivering for the Irish language surely thats a good thing right ?
I have a fair amount of Irish. I am a proud Irish Republican. I am not a member of Sinn Féin but would be a voter.
I first learned Irish in school, thanks to the Christian Brothers. The rest of the Irish I learned was through my own efforts.
Sinn Féin did not impose Irish on me. They never once asked that I learn it. In fact, most of the Sinn Féiners that I know have little to no Irish.
To listen to some of the posts here you would think that Sinn Féin ensured all members learned Irish, instructed all their voters to learn Irish and lie in the wings waiting to impose it on all others. It would be politicised then.
AG perceptions may be truth to those that see things a certain way. Yes, off course – that makes it true for them. But, let’s face it – does that make it THE truth?
Sinn Féin associate themselves and support with other issues. Are these, too, somehow tainted because Sinn Féin have taken a position on them?
We’ll soon be told that Unionist politicians and their supporters really support Gay marriage but couldn’t support it at the present time because Sinn Féin were using it as a political football.
So, AG, an Irish party supporting the right to speak the Irish language in Ireland is not palming things off. It’s not putting our fingers in our ears. It’s fact and a perfectly reasonable position to take.
Though we do need to listen those Unionists about why they have these problems with the language. And this thread allows us to do that. But, with respect, few, if any, of the arguments so far stand up to any scrutiny.
Essentially it boils down to – well we don’t like the party that shouts the most about it. If only they would stop using it, we might start using it. A nonsense argument.
Let’s try this a different way.
If the Irish language revival was modelled along the lines of a business e.g. success, then any self respecting CEO would seek to dismember all appendages that are trailing the company down on the PR (stock price) front.
During McLibel we heard about all the shenanigans McDonalds got up to and this put a lot of people off.
So some Reynholm Denholm type comes in, butts a few heads together and puts together an illusion that McDonalds do everything by the book. And it’s working (in part thanks to the improvement in coffee).
I’m not saying that SF should stop working for the Irish language altogether and to be honest I’m disappointed that you’ve reached such a digital interpretation (“if he’s not for it then he must bee completely against it!”)
What I would like to see is SF drop it from their literature, their banners, their slogans, their TV interviews and all public associations.
They can work furiously behind the scenes to promote the language.
I’m given to understand that some loyalists do.
This is a step to repairing the image of the Irish language and its vitality.
SF is a drag anchor in this respect.
To support their public use of it AND the weekend march is an oxymoron.
SF’s public use of it hinders its progress.
If the SNP started sloganeering in Gaelic then a similar rift could occur in Scotland (they’ve flirted with the idea methinks)
I personally want to see Ulster Irish thrive (and Scottish Gaelic too) so I think about what needs to be done. Coldly. Not idealistically.
As an outsider I can cast a different light on the matter, even if it is an unpopular view.
The East Belfast Mission shows that some are prepared to think for themselves so imagine what could be achieved without this psychological handicap (that SF provides).
Is there a psychiatrist in the house for I’d love to hear their opinion on the matter.
In short: SF – publicly, leave the language alone. SF – privately, knock yourself out on a personal level.
That is not a lot to ask and could indeed prove to be bountiful in its yield.
You’re all smart people here, try to concentrate on the solution as opposed to counterpoints (counterpoints are a Northern Irish speciality, solutions are a northern handicap)
Incidentally DR C, I have a pair of union jack socks and I know of people who stopped speaking German because of Hitler (Jews, obviously).
If my union Jack/fleg socks stopped me from achieving a cultural goal (dependent on your cooperation) such as this then they’d be in the bin before you could say “Uladh go Bragh!” (did I spell that right?).
What price are people actually prepared to pay?
A G – I love your stuff – and the fact that you show proper deference in addressing me…
BUT
“They [the Shinners] can work furiously behind the scenes to promote the language.” I guess that’s one possible strategy. But I’d still feel uneasy that I was allowing any group to prevent me from public engagement with my own language. There used to be a similar sort of line taken about civil rights: don’t go marching and provoking people – do it quietly and you won’t get the opposition’s back up and everyone will win. Not sure I’d have advised the civil rights people to go for the behind-the-scenes option…
No doubt Dr C, but surely if the ends justify the means in this case then it could be worth it?
If SF drop it (I’m sure their PR people could put a wonderful spin on it too e.g. a noble act, cultural martyrdom etc etc) and then this psychological barrier is broken then it could open the doors for more Protestant speakers which could (optimistically) relax that stance of the unionist politicians and make it a bit easier for an Irish Language Act to pass.
And, if there is NO discernible increase in the no. of Protestant Irish speakers (could ask Skainos to keep a tally or something) then sure they can go back to using it with gay abandon (and I will retire from the blogosphere in disgrace).
It took a lot for me to do my 180 turn on Gaelic, it came from years of mingling with Gaels in Scotland where there is not the political baggage that there is here (well, there in NI).
At least I was out of NI though, for many Protestants in NI it will take a huge effort and some sacrifices to thaw the attitudes.
This is difficult but as Skainos is showing it’s certainly not impossible.
I don’t see why we can’t pull out all the stops on this one to achieve a common objective.
There are people in the unionist community willing to lend a hand so this is certainly doable, we may just have to break a few Sinn Fein shaped oysters to get at the pearl of an Irish Language act.
Happy belated Easter BTW (I didn’t have a single chocolate egg)
AG
Is Polish still the second most spoken language after English in Northern Ireland?
It never was.
An Lá Dearg and Ciste Infheisitíochta na Gaeilge aren’t really two sides of the same coin. An Ciste is a Sinn Féin-controlled fund, created by the last British government whose response to any knock on the door was to throw money at it ‘for the good of the peace process’. In the 1980s it would have been the SDLP and the Catholic Church, today it’s Sinn Féin who are the gatekeepers when it comes to Irish language community development.
An Lá Dearg on the other hand is about the Irish language community itself. The demands being made of the state that day included a bus service for Coláiste Feirste, denied by the previous Sinn Féin education minister, which led to a court case that the department of education lost, and still denied by the current Sinn Féin education minister. It also included the demand for a second meánscoil to be established in County Derry, which has been denied by every Sinn Féin education minister since Stormont was revived. And that’s without delving into the organisations that are being shut down and the other funding that’s getting cut.
Virginia’s real? Wow, I never knew. I think most Gaeilgeoiri are glad to get support from wherever it comes from. Even the DUP, if it were offered. On one level it doesn’t really matter what non speakers think about, whoever they are.
My own unease is how stripping all infrastructure from NI and putting it several Dublin safe houses is anything other than a political retreat?
Nah, Mick – that one’s an imposter…I don’t know the detail regarding your last sentence but the impression I get is that the north must wait…