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‘Fxxx off back to your chapel’, Father, ‘where you belong’. Along with others, I was on William St in Derry in January 1969, trying to stop a group of youngsters from throwing stones at the RUC. A futile exercise but a social learning experience with the realisation, to coin a phrase, that all had changed, changed utterly. Six months earlier, nobody, especially a child, would have addressed a clergyman in those terms. I was witnessing early indications of the radicalisation of working class youth who had been marginalised for most of their short lives. Now they had a cause; they were expressing themselves and engaging with an identified oppressor. My presence was futile; some of those around me were immediate past pupils of the school where I worked. The Civil Rights group, to which I had been elected, was dismissed by Eamonn McCann as ’middle class, middle of the road and middle aged’. That evening , there was certainly an unbridgeable chasm in perceptions between me and the rioters around me. There are fairly obvious parallels between this week’s bomb attack in Manchester and the IRA action of the 80s; clear distinctions are also evident. The IRA was waging a war against an oppressor which had occupied its country for centuries; it did not deliberately target children and warnings were generally given although they frequently failed to prevent carnage. Young British Muslims have seen their parents’ homelands invaded by Western forces for the last twenty years, the persecution of Palestinians and the deaths of thousands of innocent civilians for most of this century. Those opposed to the invasion of Iraq by Bush and Blair predicted with forensic accuracy the destabilisation of the Middle East Region and the potential outcome for all of us. That’s when radicalisation gained impetus and Nice, Brussels, Paris and Manchester are inevitable results. Radicalisation has been further stimulated by the election as US President of a billionaire, shady businessman with dubious morals, clutching a golden bag of simplistic solutions to complex problems . The mega-wealthy, war mongering Saudi Regime, home of the 9/11 bombers, was pandered to by Trump this week and promised millions of dollars worth of arms to crush those opposed to their autocracy , especially in the Yemen, one of the poorest countries in the World. BREXIT , UKIP and the LEAVE Campaign may have pretended that free movement of people within Europe was its primary motivation but young British Muslims will recognise the truth with Nutall launching the Party’s manifesto today to show ‘those people’ that they cannot win. If further radicalisation is required, UKIP and its fellow travellers in the Tory Party will provide the necessary impetus. It may not have been planned but the current show of force, with the odious paras in Whitehall, will in no way hinder a Tory campaign for strong and stable government. Particularly , since in the days before the Arena attack , sections of the tabloids had attributed support for the IRA to Corbyn. The concept of ‘tackling radicalisation’ has, I feel, an implicit message that young Muslims should be prevented from having any consideration that they have received an unfair deal at the hands of the Western powers. That’s absurd but I think that most of us would subscribe to the belief that resorting to violent attacks on civilians is equally unacceptable. As a first step, attempts must be made to tackle the source of their grievances. Visits by middle class, wealthy Muslims and established, political figures in the PREVENT initiative are laughable as a serious measure to dissuade the determined. The life styles and values of those figureheads are very different to that of the majority of young Muslims, most of whom are working class and on very low incomes. The SDLP rapidly lost the respect of the young in the Six Counties and there is evidence in places like Derry that Sinn Fein are encountering similar problems, trying to keep the peace process trundling along. The bombing outrage at the Manchester pop concert resulted from a global, ideological and attitudinal problem. Can the greed of Western, imperial powers be contained? Over to Putin, Trump, May et al. |


,the bombing out at the manchester pop concert resulted from a global,ideological.and attitudinal problem……………no the bombing resulted from a piece of filth who took it upon himselff to deliberately commit child murder in the same way the moors murderers did.you pushing the leftie propaganda isnt washing.
All actions . Billy, have some kind of rationale. Your response is naive and trite. I agree that the bomber deliberately targeted the softest of targets , children on a night out. I would not seek to condone that in any way – it was a horrific event.. The piece was merely trying to explore the motivation and to make comparisons with events in the Six Counties and also to examine the mode of radicalisation. Events , I reasoned were the most potent in that respect as was seen in the North. Internment and Bloody Sunday were the outstanding catylists for IRA recruitment.
Scappaticci,Lenny Murphy,Billy Wright-all creations of British spooks.
DONAL KENNEDY ( Who for reasons unknown can’t comment directly) says “BRILLIANT! SHOULD BE SYNDICATED GLOBALLY.”. I think he may be right. Maith thú, John…
I don’t know maybe this comment will not be welcome but all across the Islamic countries i.e. Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and Palestine for instance the children are taught in Madras’s from a very young age, the more let’s say unsavory parts of the Koran and trained and encouraged to put the killing and mutilating of Gays Jews Christians women etc bits to use if the opportunity arises. The Christian end thank goodness has largely ditched the bible and a lot of its nastier teachings. And for those that didn’t want to ditch them we have put in place solid laws to prevent them from doing horrible things to other races or religions. I really do think we should be looking to Islam to do the same and to concentrate more on the sort of Ten Commandments and love your neighbor sort of bits in the Koran and let the rest slip away.
Stephen, which part of the Koran do you think is unsavory? I have read a version of it and never came across anything unsavory.
Which part of Christianity has ditched the Bible? As far as I know every Christian denomination follows the New Testament.
I don’t think Islam caused this person to carry out a bomb attack. I think ‘western’ nations have murdered so many innocent Muslims that we will definitely be seeing more of this type of attack. If the level of violence against Muslim countries was used against Christian countries we would see the same level of violence carried out by Christians.
At the start of the ‘Arab Spring’ western intelligence agencies stoked the flames and armed extremists and helped overthrow strong leaders. Strengthening the terrorist groups was the worst thing we could have done and now we are paying for it.
When Muslims have peace more may revert to a peaceful interpretation of their religion. I am sure America will revert to peace when it is profitable.
we will definitely be seeing more of this type of attack…..all the more reason to close the borders on them for now,then after the election new laws passed to sort through the ones and their supporters already here who have a hatred of western values.a strike on children enjoying a concert was part of that hatred.
Emmet
There you are, you have said it all i wish the different types of Muslim would give each other peace and maybe they could teach each other how to revert to a different interpretation of their religion (a more peaceful one) I meant that the followers of Christianity have for the most part ditched the nastier teachings of the bible you know what i meant. We will have to differ you see i do think parts of the Koran i read incites violence. Google is your friend look up Islam open your mind to the good and the bad in Islam just like Christians had to with the bible they used to slaughter rings round them to, different brands hated each other but mostly they have stopped and countries wisely became secular. You never mentioned stoning poor girls and women to death or hanging Gays in Iran just recently a sixteen year old. I personaly think Islam needs a little tweaking hey just my personal view.
(In terms of religious doctrine, many of the madrasas are funded by Saudis groups and combine Deobandi ideology with “Wahhabism as reflected in the education imparted to students in Saudi Arabia government.” Critics complain on intolerance in teachings as reflected in the line that “Muslim pupils in radical madrassas chant at the morning assembly: `When people deny our faith, ask them to convert and if they don’t destroy them utterly.`”[1] Other Saudi madrassas, particularly schools in Afghan refugee camps, may provide an interpretation of Islam that “blends Pushtun ideals and Deobandi views, precisely the hallmark of the Taliban.) This is as we speak.
(When Muslims have peace more may revert to a peaceful interpretation of their religion.) now your talking try and influence them to come yo peace with each other.
Most of the google searches on hatred from the Koran are list very dodgy sites. I could interpret the back of a cornflakes packet to incite violence if you direct a tonne of violence at me!
Again, I have read the Koran and the closet thing to violence was the idea of Jihad. But that term means ‘struggle’. For most people the struggle is to be a good and holy person and is internal.
Religion has done a lot more good for the world. The vast majority of Muslims are peace loving, as are most Buddhists, Christians and Atheists. Small groups in all of these are violent. Violence comes from circumstances not from a book.
China executes more people than any state. Between 207-2013 the USA executed the 4th largest amount of people.
Secular countries are killing a lot of people. The USA admits that it killed 352 innocent Syrian civilians last month, some groups claim it is as much as high as 2,800.
I can see you looking for something to blame for all this violence, but blaming a book doesn’t cut it. Especially when you look at cold facts and statistics. Something in the Western world has allowed us to become callous terrorists while at the same time convincing ourselves we are doing nothing wrong. Time for a people to look critically at why violence is becoming so acceptable.
Sure your great crack Emmett (the vast majority of Muslims are peace loving)lets pick a country pack your bag and head to Pakistan go to Karachi for instance (we wont even mention the tribal areas dear God Allah if you are there, help the downtrodden poor the gays the women the girls overcome the daily beatings floggings decapitations hangings. Truth is they are screwed by a bunch of old or young bollixes in the name of Mohammad and Allah or God or Hamas al-Qaeda or whoever is in charge of god in your area.) Back to say Karachi big city big port very important place ruled by thugs and scum in the name of Mohammad just the way it is an alphabet of so called religious groups.Happy birthday to me i am sixty seven today. forty seven years ago i docked in Karachi for three days on an oil tanker government guns everywhere for the first time at sea disappointment very strict no one allowed ashore. I went ashore every port i sort of treated my time at sea as a working holiday getting to see places i would never have the money to see again I left the sea four hundred and seventy pounds in dept lol my parents were not to pleased big money next stop northern Canada another story. So i did what any sensible person done before going ashore in an iffy place i sought out the loading master and when he had a break and two cases of harp labeled from the brewery in Dundalk homesick what and a bottle of whiskey dirt cheap on board. He told us that no way to guarantee safety to white Christians at the least beaten badly and robbed cant trust taxi drivers they will take you to your fate. Normally taxi drivers were our safety valve in most countries he was grateful for the booze but when pressed totally emphatic no going ashore anyway as he said the army will just rob fine you and put you back on board. So back to three months on the Indian coast. India was all right we were warned of some scary areas but stick with your taxi driver take his advice no problems just the way it was but i would never go back to witness that poverty heart breaking. Oh and i got to meet Mother Teresa in Calcutta. Normally nobody is allowed in a tanker terminal she was an exception it seems she had been with the captain and found out her best bets she knocked my cabin door and came in with two young nuns and the first mate and said you good young Irish boy you take these and handed me some things prayed and left the first mate said don’t worry the old man has paid her for you out of your shore money FORTY POUNDS a fortune in them days any way move on.Up the Persian gulf many ports wouldn’t let us ashore as the captains would say we are scum lets go the ships bar lol. Wether you like it or not be glad you live in a secular country oh dear me yes. As for the Americans and the British war machines and the sick excuses they make to poke their noses into other countries business don’t get me started i think i do hate them which is bad for me really but i try to keep it small but i avoid them Americans like the plague and Brits everyone has their own way of dealing with things that’s my way. Now is Islam ok as a religion no in my opinion like the christian religion it needs to leave behind many bad habits and so do Muslims as did Christians. Is Sharia law good well fuck my old sea boots but their is no way i want to see it in Ireland until it is well reformed. And as for America executing people i agree with you they are backward bastards now feel free to go and protest there, there is a very good chance you will make it out alive unlike protesting in a Muslim country. Me i have been up and down the american coast and no wouldn’t want to go back there either. to sum up my ramblings i think Islam and Muslims like Christian countries did before them need to make a lot of changes. I am all for secular and freedom of opinion like we have. Here i can say bugger God, i don’t like to hear that but i will live free to see another dawn with all my bits attached. And don’t start me on the books of love the Bible and the Koran.
no need for boats these days,drive down the road to ballbriggan or blackbriggan as the locals call it and you will see all you need.picture it in 20 or 30 yrs time if its allowed to continue.it will end up like when the english didnt listen to enoch powells predictions that came to happen.i think theres some here dont get out much.
Hatred and greed make violence, not religion.
they wouldnt be hated if they wernt here.just like abdul who murdered the kids in manchester shouldnt have been there.
I’m sure there were whites in America who justified their hatred by saying “they wouldnt be hated if they wernt here”, in fact I am sure there were some Protestants who would say the same about Catholics.
Abdul’s type were encouraged, supported, armed and directed by British intelligence to overthrow Gaddafi, just like ISIS were supported the same way by the US.
I would rather live in a society full of Muslims than a society full of bigots. Unfortunately here are a lot of insular bigots in Ireland.
Dear god i am sorry Jude that is so long.
Emmet
Emmet forget about Billy he is a you know.
(I would rather live in a society full of Muslims than a society full of bigots. Unfortunately here are a lot of insular bigots in Ireland.)
Well let me tell you Emmet pray that you are a rich one or somehow well of or connected, because the ordinary Muslims in most Muslim countries are poor and ruled over by strongmen and bigots and Immans who are big into suppression of individual thought by amputation hanging flogging head chopping stoning and i am sure other means just as horrific, all in the name of Mohammad and Allah.The nice side effect for them is they become rich get to travel drink fornicate gamble whatever until its home time. I have been in a few of these countries and no way would i want to live their or have my children especially my girls grow up into a life of nothingness. We in the christian west had the same type of society with our Popes Cardinals and Bishops kings Dukes whatever, until through revolution and evolution we became secular democracies. The north east of Ireland was probably the last sort of British outpost to have to be dragged into the present in the west. But here we are and we shouldn’t be afraid to point out Islamic backwardness for the sake of the poor Muslim who needs a little modern enlightenment brought into his dreary existence. (Saudi man executed for ‘witchcraft and sorcery) I mean for f–ks sake modernize please one of the richest countries in the world poor man god knows who he offended truth be told.And the princes all pissing it up in Vegas gambling and getting laid and you want to live their. Be glad you live in a secular country Emmet and get to choose what you want to do..As for the billies of this world i laugh at them now. Brrring Brinng City hall planning dept Sean speaking, bloody brilliant.