“I don’t think that there is anybody in Ireland, anybody that has any influence, that would have any qualms about a royal guest at the 2016 commemorations.”
That was the Labour Party’s Eamon Gilmore talking the other day. And there have been other voices saying the same kind of thing. So is anybody opposed to British attendance at the 2016 commemoration ceremonies?
Well, one or two. When I interviewed Jim Allister of the TUV for my book Whose Past Is It Anyway, he was his usual unambiguous self:
“They’re not going to persuade me that those who took over the GPO did the right thing and that they were anything other than how I’ve described them. If they killed in the pursuit of their aim then yes, of course they were murderers, because they weren’t regular troops, acting under the protection of a state of war. They were those engaged in an act of rebellion against the state which at that time ruled over them…And if I were invited to participate in the Easter 1916 commemorations, I think you could assume 100% that I would not be there ”.
If you leave out the word ‘murderers’ (and yes, Virginia, there are those who would be infuriated if you did), it’s hard to quarrel too much with Jim’s statement about 1916. In the same book, Ian Paisley Jr was nearly as dismissive but not quite.
“I would be moved, and I have been moved, when I go to the Somme. But not the Easter Rising commemorations. It’s just a feeling I have as a unionist. Why would I? And that’s why I say, it’s very great and glad-handy to say ‘I’d love to see republicans or nationalists coming’ I can put myself in their shoes – why would they want to understand?…Pearse was, in my view, a madman. In his own writings he compares his blood sacrifice to that of Christ’s. Those are the words of a lunatic…I don’t think the centenaries will advance anything in terms of where we are politically or where we are as nations. What they will do hopefully is increase people’s learning and people’s understanding. Will it change anyone’s views? There might be a few people around the fringes who’ll say ‘Ah, I get it now!’ Will it make republicans become unionists or unionists become more republican? I doubt it”.
There’s some truth in what Ian says. Martin McGuinness made a similar point after this week’s meetings with Queen Elizabeth – he was an Irish republican before he shook hands and he remained an Irish republican after it. So what is the purpose of these attendances, particularly the attendance of a member of the royal family or of the British government at 2016 commemorations?
Well, it all depends on how you interpret them. If you interpret them as the British or the British monarchy saying that yes, one hundred years ago the twenty-six counties engaged in violence to achieve independence, but that’s all over now and we wish to be good friends and good trading partners, then the British monarchy/politicians’ attendance is desirable and worthwhile. If you interpret attendance (and yes, this is where I get edgy, Viirginia) as signifying that those events were 100 years ago and the English-Irish quarrel has now ended completely, we now have normality of relations between two countries, I’m afraid I beg to disagree. What’s more, I can’t rid myself of the suspicion that the southern government is working very hard to encourage the second interpretation of the two rather than the first. Why do I disagree? Because I dislike being erased – literally, metaphorically or nationally.
Jude :
I see what you mean Jude. My feeling has been that those in the Republic , for the most part , are quite happy with this current status quo. There has never been an upsurge of emotion or political longing in the south to somehow bring back those lost six counties and all those citizens {subjects!} who were abandoned beyond the border .The fact that we all appeared to be such a bitter and truculent bunch probably consolidated that idea, ..Let’s get real …if you had a noisy neighbour , would you want to invite him back in to the house?
Let’s get real …if you had a noisy neighbour , would you want to invite him back in to the house?
That is exactly were we all are for better or worse
Jude, those in the south of Ireland like Eamon Gilmore who beleive in the Union should be defined as Uionist even though they are not Protestant or even religious. Regligion should not classify a person as a Uionist.
My thought is that to those irishmen in the Republic, we in the North are too much like hard work now and they’ve lived without us for so long that even if we batter at their door to join the party , they’ll quite happily ignore our entreaties.
It’s fine for romantic, abandoned republicans in the North to want to join their Republican neighbours in the south and that sounds good to me , but it’s not just the unionists in the North or the English who want to hold the process back ….It’s our southern cousins too….certainly for the foreseeable future..
That’s why it will be a long process .We can’t be simply batter into the game that is already being played because most of the other players don’t want us in.just yet.The unionists have their reasons which to my mind are a fairly toxic mixture of fear, bigotry , economics and pure cussedness .
They’ve hurt their Nationalist neighbours and these neighbours reciprocated but hurting them every bit as much.So everyone’s holding grudges.The unionists appear to be blissfully unaware that they’ve done anything to annoy anyone so until they realise that it takes two to tango and that their neighbours were not simply bogymen who suddenly decided to shake up the state for no apparent reason , we’ll never understand anything or get anywhere.
.
A lot of northern Nationalist s are similarly crookedly cussed.. They want to join with the Republic, not because they actually know or have considered what being in a republic entails , but because they want to feel in a stronger and more benign position than their current Unionist neighbours.
The reality is that for a move like this to properly succeed, they need to be on more friendly terms with both their immediate Northern unionist neighbours , but also their significantly different Southern ones. A few economic facts need to be hammered out for example.
The violence has mostly stopped but we are still picking at each other’s scabs by insulting each other.
As long as we keep doing that to each other there’ll always be conflict.
Imagine an all-Ireland Republic that still needs “Peace Walls” built around particular areas like those gated compounds that the rich live in to protect them from the poor. Unless a few social problems are fixed first in Northern Ireland, the British will not be tempted to “abandon” the North and there’s no way thet those south of the imaginary line will be inviting us in the North to join their little party ….anytime soon…
I think Sinn Fein know this and are working slowly on a possible way out of it…..
“I dislike being erased”—-Don’t think there’s much chance of that,Jude!
The cheek of the west brit Gilmore to believe that nobody has any qualms about a royal visit in 2016, and as for the part “nobody that has any influence”, just shows his elitist mentality!
The Government set up an Advisory Group on Centenary Commemorations 2 years ago and Diarmaid Ferriter is a member he said
“the question of course now is where do you bring this, how appropriate how wise is it to invite members of the Royal family to Dublin in 2016.
It does seem to me that they have left themselves wriggle room, I don’t think it will be the Queen, it’s unlikely to be a senior royal figure but even the very idea of a royal in Dublin in 2016 – is that appropriate?”
The reality is, if any member of the royal family is in Dublin for the 2016 commemoration’s, just like bettys windsors last visit, there will be a ring of steel around Dublin and the people will be kept away for security reasons, most likely as before O’Connell street will be closed to the public and as the GPO is on O’Connell street I cant see how any member of the royal family will be in Dublin for the Easter Commemorations 2016.
The west brit media and current Government would like us all to believe that Ireland and England are the best of friends, even though they still lay claim to the north east of our island and it only took 800 odd years for us to be seen as equals and for us to achieve parity of esteem.
Owen Rodgers is correct, people like Eamonn Gilmore SHOULD define themselves as Unionist. Their folk memories of the Black and Tans and the British oppression and injustice in the rest of the country are gone. However northern Nationalist memories are still raw, as are the memories of the Unionists. I do not want to `join` the south, I want a new Ireland, a fresh start, with a huge influence from the Protestant people. They are a significant part of the population and one day they will take their rightful places, an integral part of the Nation, rather than the tiny rump they are now, an unwanted, feared part of the UK.
Some great comments from everyone above.
(Especially Another Jude’s “fresh start”, I’ve been using that on other blogs).
A point of order though.
If indeed the south and Britain are ‘over it’ but we in NI are not and our failure to be ‘over it’ is making us unattractive to either mother ship then does tact and strategy not demand that both parties in the north should tone it down a tad to make their ‘stall’ more attractive to the powers that be?
I believe that nationalism, in the true sense of the word (and I’ve experienced Scottish nationalism, Croatian nationalism, Serbian nationalism, Australian nationalism, Irish nationalism and Northern Irish British (?) nationalism is an unattractive quality.
And now we have nationalists of various hues lamenting that a certain overly ‘nationalist’ part of these islands has very little appeal to either Dublin or London.
I’m (prematurely perhaps) taking this as a confirmation of my unfavourable view of nationalism (proper nationalism, just in case you missed my disclaimer earlier).
Some day the penny will drop.
Unfortunately as we know the republicans were defeated in the civil war and the present Southern Government just like their predecessors haven’t got a republican thread in them .No doubt about the agenda now let’s all be good British Subjects in this part of The British Isles roll on the hero’s who fought against those horrible Republicans In 1916!
Gilmore’s attitude while not surprising is still disturbing. First his suggestion that no one has any qualms is pure fiction. It shows how detached and/or how unconcerned he is with the needs of the general populist. Secondly, as anthony states, his elitist attitude that no one with ‘influence’ reaffirms this.
I have to copmare thsi to4th of July when the US celebrates independence, why would they invite the royal family? What purpose does it serve? It would seemingly be very uncomfortable for both parties.
As someone comented, the centenary should be for the people, not heads of state. Muted remembrances so as not to offend anyone, should not be the orderr of the day. How many muted remembrances are held in the 6 counties from July 12th to Aug 12th? Not too many. Be proud that in 1916 men had had enough and started the country on the path to freedom. Hopefully the rest of Ireland will know a better freedom as well someday soon , that includes all as Tone aspired to.